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bam bam 4ever
28 Sep 04, 16:01
With clubs in Italy almost competing for bankrupcy in these years I want to know more about how Inters finances are ?

With our spending spree and low didget player sales on the transfer market it obviously cant be too good. I know about the welth of the Moratti family and Pirellis contribution, but how can we, one year after another, keep on spending as we do? (Davids and Cambiasso signed as free agents but as far as i know with a lot of cash in sign on and performance related bonuses)

I´m currently working on a report on dansih club FC Copenhagens positive economy in business school and they for example own their stadium and other money making entertainment arenas to make bucks available for purchasing new players.

is Inter´s capability to compete( at least on a financial level!) in top football for so long without being a regular in CL´s euro-wonderland a question of italian account number jugling or are we making dough?

SB9Dragon
28 Sep 04, 21:35
I have also been wondering about this. Some sites report us having a good amount of cash available to buy players though the management are acting as if we are on a slim budget and we have to offload a player the likes of Cannavaro to stay in check.

Shaun
29 Sep 04, 03:01
I know in the 2002 season we cut our debt from 100million to 30 million but thats the last I heard. But I know our revenue coming in is among the best in Europe, top 5 I think.

K.I.
29 Sep 04, 11:54
1. Manchester United 251.4m
2. Juventus 218.3m
3. AC Milan 200.2m
4. Real Madrid 192.6m
5. Bayern Munich 162.7m
6. Internazionale Milan 162.4m
7. Arsenal 149.6m
8. Liverpool 149.4m
9. Newcastle United 138.9m
10. Chelsea 133.8m
11. AS Roma 132.4m
12. Borussia Dortmund 124m
13. Barcelona 123.4m
14. Schalke 04 118.6m
15. Tottenham Hotspur 16 95.6m
16. Leeds United 92m
17. SS Lazio 88.9m
18. Celtic 87m
19. Olympique Lyonnais 84.3m
20. Valencia 80.5m

and over the last 15 years we didnt win anything so i think thats pretty good but if we start wining i think the stadium will be full and finance will be higher
N.B: U HAVE TO READ THIS

Record Low Ticket Sales For Juve Games Continue
9/29/2004 12:33:00 PM
Juventus continue to suffer from terrible attendances at their Champions League home games.
Yesterday’s match versus Maccabi Tel Aviv saw only 6,494 tickets sold, 1,000 of which were bought by the Israeli side’s fans.

It is now three consecutive seasons that Juve’s ticket sales for Champions League matches have been progressively decreasing, a trend the Bianconero management is unable to stop.
my source:
http://www.goal.com/NewsDetail.aspx?idNews=24486&progr=1

i really dont know how r they the second richest club in the world?? :confused:

SB9Dragon
29 Sep 04, 23:47
Ahly Inter, just because Juve has the 2nd biggest amount of revenue doesn't mean they are really the 2nd richest team in the world. Income is one thing, but minusing all the player contracts, coach deals, and all the other expenses will probably lower them down the list.

cool_cuchu
30 Sep 04, 00:25
two or three years ago, juve was the only team in italy that can make profit.... so they're in better shape in term of financial management compared to any team in italy...

inter and milan are different from juve, juve is listed in stock market, while inter and milan are not...

inter money are mainly backed up by the owners, so this is not a healthy pratice, but we're alright since we have someone like moratti ensuring every player got paid regularly..

with facchetti management, inter try to be more profesionalls by cutting cost and better transfer campaign...

so things are looking up...

with mancini's style, adriano's explosion and perhaps some top throphies, we can pass Mu and real... provided we continue to improve our finance management

MoH
30 Sep 04, 13:38
...Erm, stop worrying, it seems some of you guys forgot the debts Moratti cleared when he became in charge :D we haven’t done anything suicidal lately (Well, financially speaking)

Pod
01 Oct 04, 10:35
New article by italian journalist Franco Rossi.
It's says that we saved 50 mln this year if I'm not wrong.


Tanto peggio tanto meglio, il calcio italiano va sempre più a fondo.
I debiti sono aumentati a dismisura e le società hanno già incassato i diritti televisivi dei prossimi anni, l’immagine da un punto di vista tecnico è quella di un calcio che tra Mondiali ed Europei ha vinto solo contro Ecuador e Bulgaria, l’opinione pubblica conta meno di zero, drogata come è da giornali e tv che nella loro maggioranza sono complici di un Potere perverso.

L’Inter a giugno ha ricapitalizzato per 50 milioni, il Milan, nel quasi silenzio totale, nei giorni scorsi ha chiuso con 30 milioni di passivo, la Juventus di debiti ne ha di meno, ma i tempi dei bilanci sani e da portare a modello sono finiti.

I responsabili di questo sfascio tecnico ed economico avevano promesso di andarsene.

Subito dopo gli Europei il presidente della Federcalcio aveva presentato delle finte dimissioni , mentre Adriano Galliani, non più tardi dello scorso 5 maggio aveva promesso: non mi ricandiderò mai più.

Ma la complicità e la connivenza hanno preso il sopravvento e Carraro che due anni fa, subito dopo il Mondiale, era stato “garantito” (ci fu un clamoroso: guai a chi lo tocca!!!) da un presidente di società che, casualmente, è anche il capo del Governo, sembra destinato a rimanere a vita abbarbicato alla sua poltrona.

E’ l’uomo che nel mondo, dopo Fidel Castro, da più tempo è al Potere, è l’uomo che ha portato alla rovina economica, tecnica e morale il calcio italiano.

Galliani che con il Milan oltre al record di vittorie ha anche quello della mala amministrazione (17 bilanci in rosso su 18) resterà presidente della Lega.

Lo vogliono le Grandi (la Juve gli ha fatto una campagna elettorale strepitosa) e anche le Piccole (il Cahliari non è stato da meno): lo vogliono tutti affinché continui a governare il calcio italiano.

Nessuno ha più pudore e non c’è più un’opposizione seria.

A ottobre lo voteranno e poi ricominceranno le solite storie del conflitto di interessi.

Carraro e Galliani sono due persone per bene, ma con i fatti hanno dimostrato di non essere in grado di governare il mondo del calcio (ripeto, sono già stati incassati persino i soldi di campionati che devono ancora cominciare), ma restano al loro posto perché gli altri sono peggio di loro.

Sono proprio curioso di vedere se anhche ad ottobre Gallaini sarà eletto all’unanimità come l’altra volta…

Se esiste un’opposizione seria si faccia avanti prima che sia troppo tardi.

Francorossi.com

Bianconeri
01 Oct 04, 13:33
Ahly Inter, just because Juve has the 2nd biggest amount of revenue doesn't mean they are really the 2nd richest team in the world. Income is one thing, but minusing all the player contracts, coach deals, and all the other expenses will probably lower them down the list.

you're wrong in here... Financially Juve is the best club in the world, no doubt about it... It was not very long time ago when Forbes wrote that every football club in the world should handle their financials like Juve does... :proud:

Anyway, you're safe as long as Moratti keeps pumping oil... Roma is screwed, and Milan's financials are pretty much dependable of Berlusconi...

Ziyad
01 Oct 04, 14:48
With the prices of oil going up and Moratti being an oil baron we are more than safe for the time being...Plus our spending looks good and wise this season for once. ;)

Bianconeri
02 Oct 04, 17:49
With the prices of oil going up and Moratti being an oil baron we are more than safe for the time being...Plus our spending looks good and wise this season for once. ;)

LOL, you really think that you spended the money wisely?! So buying not needed players was cool?!

Gismo
02 Oct 04, 17:55
What not needed players? Sinisa Mihajlovic? ;)

Fabio
02 Oct 04, 17:58
With the prices of oil going up and Moratti being an oil baron we are more than safe for the time being...Plus our spending looks good and wise this season for once. ;)

LOL, you really think that you spended the money wisely?! So buying not needed players was cool?!

I agree with Ziyad on this one,this season speaking of course.Because the fact is that we hardly spent anything(money only spent on Burdisso and Ze Maria)

And as for the not needed players comment:

Carini Not needed
Burdisso Brings an element to the club
Favalli Brings an element to the club
Mihajlovic Not needed
Ze Maria Brings an element to the club
Cambiasso Brings an element to the club
Davids Brings an element to the club
Veron Brings an element to the club
Choutos Not needed

So that means that out of 9 new players,3 we didn't really need and the other 6 will help us in our hunt for glory which means we will need them.

Fabio :)

Jesse
03 Oct 04, 03:18
You mention that Carini was not needed, but may I ask, who will replace Toldo when he retires? Fontana is OLDER than Francesco, and the last time Cordaz recieved any time was when Toldo got sent off in the Copa Italia game. What will happen without an experienced, yet young custodian between the posts?

-Jesse

Frisko
03 Oct 04, 09:20
Bianconeri said: LOL, you really think that you spended the money wisely?! So buying not needed players was cool?!

LOL Bianconeri, you really have no shame!

So Inter bought lots of not needed players right? What about Juve? Just explain to me why you pay wages to 6 central defenders (Thuram-Cannavaro-Montero-Le Grottaglie-Ferrara-Iuliano-Tudor) and you have only 4 strikers, including Del Piero who is just a bit injury prone, isn't he? And obviously the 4 strikers also include Fenomeno Zalayeta. :dielaugh:

Juve's squad is 26 players, Inter's 30.

DEFENCE: Inter 10 players, Juve 11.

MIDFIELD: Inter 11, Juve 8.

ATTACK: Inter 6 (Including Choutos), Juve 4.

I think you should think twice before criticising Inter's squad mate, if you compare it to a Juve side that seems to care only about defending: as long as you have 11 defenders, who cares if Del Piero and Trezeguet get injured? You always have Camoranesi to get a header after a corner and score the 1-0 for you, for the pleasure of the 5,000 people going to see the game at the Delle Alpi :dielaugh:

Fabio
03 Oct 04, 12:59
You mention that Carini was not needed, but may I ask, who will replace Toldo when he retires? Fontana is OLDER than Francesco, and the last time Cordaz recieved any time was when Toldo got sent off in the Copa Italia game. What will happen without an experienced, yet young custodian between the posts?

-Jesse

I meant that we don't really need him now,but maybe in the future...

Fabio :)

Bianconeri
03 Oct 04, 16:02
LOL Bianconeri, you really have no shame!

So Inter bought lots of not needed players right? What about Juve? Just explain to me why you pay wages to 6 central defenders (Thuram-Cannavaro-Montero-Le Grottaglie-Ferrara-Iuliano-Tudor) and you have only 4 strikers, including Del Piero who is just a bit injury prone, isn't he? And obviously the 4 strikers also include Fenomeno Zalayeta. :dielaugh:

Juve's squad is 26 players, Inter's 30.

DEFENCE: Inter 10 players, Juve 11.

MIDFIELD: Inter 11, Juve 8.

ATTACK: Inter 6 (Including Choutos), Juve 4.

I think you should think twice before criticising Inter's squad mate, if you compare it to a Juve side that seems to care only about defending: as long as you have 11 defenders, who cares if Del Piero and Trezeguet get injured? You always have Camoranesi to get a header after a corner and score the 1-0 for you, for the pleasure of the 5,000 people going to see the game at the Delle Alpi :dielaugh:

LOL, we spended our money very wisely, we got what we needed... And I really don't what Iuliano is doing with us, but otherwise we have just perfectly balanced squad...

Shaun
29 Oct 04, 21:45
INTER SHAREHOLDERS APPROVE BUDGET Friday, 29 October 2004 19:58:59
MILAN - The F.C. Internazionale S.p.A. shareholders met at Milan 's Teatro delle Erbe tonight to approve the 2003/04 budget and appoint the board of directors, which later met at the club's headquarters in via Durini. The operating loss for 2003/04 is 97 million euros, the majority of which (54 million euros) has been covered by existing reserves (dated to 30 June 2004). The remaining loss (43 million euros) will be covered by future capital reserves
well this is bad news and I can see more of the same this year as we have sold less season tickets and our wage bill would be about the same our only hope is if we win the champions league or come close to it!

coolmavs
09 Oct 09, 22:36
BUMP!

I am just curious, with all the rumors/speculation about Inter considering selling Maicon/Cesar, how big are Inter financially in world and Italian football?

I know that all FC's want to improve profits, but are we doing so bad economically that we have to consider selling our best players, to maintain good balancesheets?

InterArad
09 Oct 09, 23:15
BUMP!

I am just curious, with all the rumors/speculation about Inter considering selling Maicon/Cesar, how big are Inter financially in world and Italian football?

I know that all FC's want to improve profits, but are we doing so bad economically that we have to consider selling our best players, to maintain good balancesheets?

who said we consider it?manchester wants them that`s it,it doesn`t mean we accepted to sell them..

junior55
10 Oct 09, 07:59
BUMP!

I am just curious, with all the rumors/speculation about Inter considering selling Maicon/Cesar, how big are Inter financially in world and Italian football?
I know that all FC's want to improve profits, but are we doing so bad economically that we have to consider selling our best players, to maintain good balancesheets?

I think it's not about balance...
In this moment is tough period for finances and most important we have to build a new stadium which is very costly.
For what i remember all the big clubs in the year of building stadium investiment haven't been active in the transfer market.
So what i mean is that if man.utd comes and offers 40milion for j.cesar than inter will take it in consideration in order to have fresh money for investiments

10GladiatoreMilano10
10 Oct 09, 17:56
moratti just give us 200mio euros and buy...MESSI,VAN DER VAART and HAMSIK..
JUST DO IT you rich bastard ;) haha

Nyall
10 Oct 09, 23:57
Messi alone costs 250 million euros. :rollani:

tritolone
12 Oct 09, 00:44
As a club/company Inter is deeply in debts...but those debts are at Moratti (him personally, not his company or anything). Until he is here, we have no problems at all:D

Intercalcio13
29 Jan 10, 01:59
Moratti claims that were not, but just about every other Football expert seems to think that we are in massive debt.

Are we in Debt?

mario.santon
29 Jan 10, 04:38
perhaps, the money moratti spend on inter to cover our debt becomes share addition

Stefan
29 Jan 10, 08:20
Each and every club has debt. It depends whether its manageable debt or not. Ours is manageable, its nothing like the massive debt that man utd is carrying. Moratti knows what he is doing.

Luka
29 Jan 10, 08:58
The debt is internal. It is like Moratti was borrowing his money from company A, to company B.

It probably has something to do with taxes or others financial issues.

We have 0$ debt in any foreign parties, like banks etc. Sleep safe.

Black&Blue
29 Jan 10, 22:40
The debt is internal. It is like Moratti was borrowing his money from company A, to company B.

It probably has something to do with taxes or others financial issues.

We have 0$ debt in any foreign parties, like banks etc. Sleep safe.

exactly.

Intercalcio13
30 Jan 10, 21:55
Thats very good too know

Victory
14 Feb 10, 15:53
I don't know if there is a thread to discuss specifically revenue and finance related matters with Inter, but it would be a good addition.

Lately it seems like Inter as a club is making less and less money.

Businessweek 2008 (http://images.businessweek.com/ss/09/02/0217_richest_football_clubs/11.htm): Inter goes from #9 in 2007 to #10 in 2008.

Revenues: €172.9 million ($221.7 million)

Revenue Sources: Commercial (21%), Game day (17%), Broadcasting (62%)

Internazionale, or Inter for short, has been the dominant force in Italian soccer for the last three years. The club has won the domestic league three years in a row and finished second in the 2007-2008 Coppa Italia. Yet like its Italian rivals, Inter is highly dependent on broadcasting revenue. Combined, the club earns less than half of its annual revenues from commercial and game day sales. To solve this problem, Inter's President Massimo Moratti plans to build a new, larger stadium for the 2012-2013 season.

In 2007 Inter's revenue was over 200 million euros I think. And in 2009 it was still down 30 million euros. (Forbes (http://www.forbes.com/lists/2009/34/soccer-values-09_Internazionale-Milan_340007.html))

Revenue $272(€173/£137) Million
Income $27(€17/£13) Million
Debt/Value 77%

Here's a chart (http://www.forbes.com/lists/2009/34/soccer-values-09_Soccer-Team-Valuations_Rank.html) for comparison with other clubs.

Inter's current (http://www.eufootball.biz/Sponsorship/5032-090108-Inter-Milan-Nike.html) Nike deal runs 10 years until June 2019, with Inter earning 12-14 million euros per season.

Details of Pirelli sponsorship deal as of 2009 (http://www.pirelli.com/en_IT/browser/attachments/pdf/Report9M2009.pdf)

Other expenses 7.5 These refer to costs for the sponsorship of F.C. Internazionale
Milano S.p.A..
Current trade payables 2.7 These are payables connected with the aforementioned
expenses relating to F.C. Internazionale Milano S.p.A.

The numbers 7.5 and 2.7 are in millions. I don't know what exactly they mean in context.

I found this (http://worldsoccerconnection.net/blog/view/id_719/title_the-teams-with-the-highest-revenue-transfers-in/), which has no source but puts Inter at #1 for 2009/2010

Luka
14 Feb 10, 18:01
These all figures are estimations. Those are not the numbers based on facts, simply because Inter is not a public company, and is not releasing financial reports to the public.

I'm not saying this cannot be the case, just that we can't know really how the situation looks.

coolmavs
15 Feb 10, 00:55
Here's a chart (http://www.forbes.com/lists/2009/34/soccer-values-09_Soccer-Team-Valuations_Rank.html) for comparison with other clubs.

As per this chart Bbilan's revenues are so much higher than ours! How is that possible?

Trance
15 Feb 10, 18:29
As per this chart Bbilan's revenues are so much higher than ours! How is that possible?

That is BS. No way can Roma or Lyon or Schalke be worth more than us.

Seriously wtf.

nerazzurri4life
15 Feb 10, 18:50
chart is 1000% nonsense...

chelsea/manU/liverpool debt/value ratio should be the highest of all clubs
also, Inter's operating income is above all teams in serie A, maybe with Jube very close...

Roma's operating income is next to nothing...

pazzainteramala
16 Feb 10, 02:18
we are the best financially in serie a ..but serie a is nothing compared to epl and spanish league. we need one of those arabs like in mancity or abrahmovic to allows us to shop freely

coolmavs
16 Feb 10, 02:42
How is the Spanish league so rich? What sets it apart from Serie A?

Stefan
16 Feb 10, 05:52
we are the best financially in serie a ..but serie a is nothing compared to epl and spanish league. we need one of those arabs like in mancity or abrahmovic to allows us to shop freely

No we don't. The difference between serie a and the epl is the stadiums and marketing. EPL teams generate huge amounts from their stadiums on match days while we generate very little which is why we need the new stadium. Serie a's marketing is pathetic compared to the epl which also makes a big difference.

Ziyad
16 Feb 10, 07:22
No we don't. The difference between serie a and the epl is the stadiums and marketing. EPL teams generate huge amounts from their stadiums on match days while we generate very little which is why we need the new stadium. Serie a's marketing is pathetic compared to the epl which also makes a big difference.

Spot on Stefan..

We lack in the marketing,and not just compared to EPL and La Liga but even in comparison to Roma,Milan and Juve if you can believe it.

We also lack in TV rights,that will change however in the next two years.

We lack in Stadium attendances,which the other two leagues dont in addition to the German league,which usually has the best attendances.

We lack in stadium revenues because we dont own the stadium and not only do we have to pay rent,we cant utilize it for other kind of revenue streams either unlikes the teams that own the stadium.

Once you factor all these things,you will find that we are lucky to have the best owner when it comes to spending in any football club,handsdown:star:

I wish however we could do things better running the club better marketing wise and being able to open new revenue horizons to make us even better.

Black&Blue
16 Feb 10, 08:49
Spot on Stefan..

We lack in the marketing,and not just compared to EPL and La Liga but even in comparison to Roma,Milan and Juve if you can believe it.


How can you say that we are lack in the marketing in comparasion with Roma,Milan and Juve???? sorry,but this is bullshit (especially if you talk about Juventus and Roma)

Black&Blue
16 Feb 10, 08:51
How is the Spanish league so rich? What sets it apart from Serie A?

the unique differences are Real Madrid and Barcelona,the other teams are full of debts (although they have better stadiums than us in Italy,look at Valencia or Athletic Bilbao for example,not only Nou Camp or Bernabeu,and just like England or Germany they own their stadiums)

Black&Blue
16 Feb 10, 08:59
No we don't. The difference between serie a and the epl is the stadiums and marketing. EPL teams generate huge amounts from their stadiums on match days while we generate very little which is why we need the new stadium. Serie a's marketing is pathetic compared to the epl which also makes a big difference.

Stadiums and marketing are just one of reasons of why EPL is the richest and the most important league in the world (EPL produces even more than NBA!)

Stefan
16 Feb 10, 11:08
Spot on Stefan..

We lack in the marketing,and not just compared to EPL and La Liga but even in comparison to Roma,Milan and Juve if you can believe it.

We also lack in TV rights,that will change however in the next two years.

We lack in Stadium attendances,which the other two leagues dont in addition to the German league,which usually has the best attendances.

We lack in stadium revenues because we dont own the stadium and not only do we have to pay rent,we cant utilize it for other kind of revenue streams either unlikes the teams that own the stadium.

Once you factor all these things,you will find that we are lucky to have the best owner when it comes to spending in any football club,handsdown:star:

I wish however we could do things better running the club better marketing wise and being able to open new revenue horizons to make us even better.


Agree with most ziyad except that we are behind roma,juve and milan as far as marketing goes. I mean roma's website doesn't even have an english version. We have also made massive strides in establishing the club in china. As far as serie a clubs go I would say our marketing is good.

My comment about marketing was more the league itself and all the clubs. I mean how can you hope to capture a global audience when a lot of your clubs don't have an english version of their website?? That's basic and then you actually need to update it regularly(looking at you inter.it).

Ziyad
16 Feb 10, 11:42
Stefan,
U might not notice it from here.But i urge you to go into the both the Inter store and the Roma store.HUGE difference...Hell even the Milan side of the San Siro store is much better than ours.I was there for sometime looking at the different products and our side doesnt have many of the things in store that are on the website.Hell they didnt have long sleeve jersies in the middle of winter..TO me that is ill equipped..

Another thing if you are comparing to Roma please take into consideration the star power and financial backing each has and you will see that we are not getting the max out of our Euro..

As for outside of Italy i can tell you that you will find more Juve and Milan merchandise here in the middle east that you would of Inter.This is even during the year that Juve was in Serie B believe it or not..The same applies in London in any footballing shop including Nike town.

Being ahead in the China market is fine but we need more out of our euro when it comes to marketing..

Black&Blue
16 Feb 10, 12:34
Stefan,
U might not notice it from here.But i urge you to go into the both the Inter store and the Roma store.HUGE difference...Hell even the Milan side of the San Siro store is much better than ours.I was there for sometime looking at the different products and our side doesnt have many of the things in store that are on the website.Hell they didnt have long sleeve jersies in the middle of winter..TO me that is ill equipped..

Another thing if you are comparing to Roma please take into consideration the star power and financial backing each has and you will see that we are not getting the max out of our Euro..

As for outside of Italy i can tell you that you will find more Juve and Milan merchandise here in the middle east that you would of Inter.This is even during the year that Juve was in Serie B believe it or not..The same applies in London in any footballing shop including Nike town.

Being ahead in the China market is fine but we need more out of our euro when it comes to marketing..

Merchandise is a legend,Inter website is the most visited between all italian clubs in the world,so this means we have much more fans than Milan,Juventus,etc. as shops and likes,you must see the new Winterstore opened lately in Milan,it's fucking awesome.

Ziyad
16 Feb 10, 14:01
We know we have the fanbase..We need that to translate into $$$ more. With the fans we have,the star power we have and appeal,there is no way IMHO that we are fullfilling our marketing potential.

Suneet
16 Feb 10, 16:11
If anyone wants to get me a job, I will make the Inter store better than Meeelans. :D

I completely agree with Ziyad, we just need to spend a few million on marketing our club, maybe buy a newspaper in Italy first.

Nyall
16 Feb 10, 21:16
Stadiums and marketing are just one of reasons of why EPL is the richest and the most important league in the world (EPL produces even more than NBA!)

The NBA is nothing. If you could prove that it produced more than the MLB or NFL then I would be impressed.

CafeCordoba
17 Feb 10, 06:58
Stefan,

As for outside of Italy i can tell you that you will find more Juve and Milan merchandise here in the middle east that you would of Inter.This is even during the year that Juve was in Serie B believe it or not..The same applies in London in any footballing shop including Nike town.

Being ahead in the China market is fine but we need more out of our euro when it comes to marketing..

Yep, that is an interesting fact. Wherever I've been in Europe, there's Juve and Milan, but hardly Inter. Those two have simply created the status of theirs in the market with their previous success years. Maybe that is going to change a bit, but at the same time the glory of Serie A is declining so we are not getting all the advantage of being the first in Italy.

Also that comparison to Milan, Juve, Roma, the one aspect is sponsorship deals. We don't have many Italians and I'm sure that is affecting too in making deals in Italy. That's why we have to hope Santon and Balotelli will be our new center figures and important players. Them being Italian star players will most probably generate more money than foreigners.

We are putting effort to Asian market and that's good since there's the new spending potential.

Black&Blue
18 Feb 10, 11:31
Inter nowdays is the richest club and with much more power and appeal in the market in Italy and one of the richest in Europe (although not on the same level of Man City,Man United,Chelsea,Real Madrid,Barcelona and probably Bayern Munchen),merchandising or stadiums are just a minimal part of the business,look at a club like Ajax that owns one of the most beautiful modern stadiums in the World like the Amsterdam Arena and then look at their financial situation,and then you'll get the point.

Ziyad
19 Feb 10, 18:29
Inter nowdays is the richest club and with much more power and appeal in the market in Italy and one of the richest in Europe (although not on the same level of Man City,Man United,Chelsea,Real Madrid,Barcelona and probably Bayern Munchen),merchandising or stadiums are just a minimal part of the business,look at a club like Ajax that owns one of the most beautiful modern stadiums in the World like the Amsterdam Arena and then look at their financial situation,and then you'll get the point.

I hate to break it to you but Inter situation with the stadium is costing them around 70 million a year. I wouldnt know the merchandising numbers exactly but i would assume its another chunk of money that isnt a minimal part of the business...

As for Ajax having their own stadium and not running it well thats another story..Look at teams in the EPL that have fantastic revenues equaling our totals because they are..

rsz85
01 Mar 10, 20:23
Latest Deloitte report about revenues (2008-09 season)

We are 9th, with 195 millions euro. Before, we were 10th (with 173 mill), this season managed to overtake Milan and Roma, but juve get in front of us.

This 195 million is about the same as the 06-07 season.

Real Madrid is brutal, they have more than 400 million revenue in 08-09. more than twice of ours....

Stefan
02 Mar 10, 10:20
Interesting stats from the deloite report.

Our overall revenue increased 14% from the previous year. Our commercial income increased with 43% due to increased sponsorship deals from both nike and pirelli. Interesting the report only mentions redevelopment, nothing on the new stadium.

The major issue is still the match day income. With us only earning 14% as opposed to the top earners who at min earn 21%(bayern being the lowest) and clubs like chelsea earning 40%. We really need to up this especially with collective tv deals coming in.

CafeCordoba
02 Mar 10, 11:52
I'm not sure if this works, but try to download the report here (http://int.sitestat.com/deloitte/uk/s?SBG_FML2010&ns_type=pdf).

Yeah, this season is the last one for Italian top teams having their own broadcasting deals. Starting from next season, there will be a collective broadcasting deal for the whole Serie A. Better for the league generally, worse for single top clubs (Inter, Juve, Milan, Roma, Napoli, ... ).

That was indeed an interesting that nothing was said about the new stadium project. Hopefully it's just because there's been no official word at all regarding that plan and Deloitte has just based everything on official statements. It's clear that Italian FA have to somehow get stadiums at better state if they want to have EURO 2016 in Italy.

It's still worrying as Juventus will have their stadium ready in summer 2011, only 1 and ½ seasons from this moment (even if it will be rather small, 40k). We can't drag back too much longer. No official word yet, so hopefully that will arrive in the summer at the latest. Probably it takes time before they can start building it and it takes couple of years before it's ready for use. They started to build Juve stadium last summer so it's takes 2 years to get that stadium ready. No idea does it take longer to get a bigger stadium ready (something which has been in rumors for our new stadium).

So hopefully we can get our stadium plan ready soon and everything ready for the building phase. Might go to 2013 to get our stadium (if they really are going to do that).

Btw, English clubs' situation looks cemented but I don't think they will last there forever. There is so much going on behind the scenes, like with Liverpool's debts and ManU's debts. Both are related to American owners who don't have too much money for those clubs. Possible Arab owners are their salvation. Real and Barca are on their own level with Spain's taxation shit and those two clubs being their national treasures. The state won't fuck up with them (with some tax rules, bank loans, etc. etc.) and that's why there must be all kind of "financial doping" going on with those clubs. Hard to compete against them economically.

Stefan
02 Mar 10, 11:57
The reports have always said our stadium would be in 2013/2014 at the earliest. But yeah hopefully we get official word soon.

I did try and upload the report so everyone can read it but the forum doesn't support pdf uploads.

jmaster
03 Mar 10, 17:14
The reports have always said our stadium would be in 2013/2014 at the earliest. But yeah hopefully we get official word soon.

I did try and upload the report so everyone can read it but the forum doesn't support pdf uploads.

Did the stadium start to build?

Victory
04 Mar 10, 03:25
http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=it&u=http://milano.blogosfere.it/2008/06/inter-a-massimo-moratti-piace-il-progetto-del-nuovo-stadio-tra-2013-e-2016-1.html&ei=3TWPS7WjMYP0M8jn2IQN&sa=X&oi=translate&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CAgQ7gEwAA&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dinter%2Bstadio%2Bnovo%26hl%3Den%26sa% 3DG%26rlz%3D1C1CHMP_en-USUS306US308


For many years, and Inter Milan have divided the field, stadium and stands. But in future, all will have a stadium of its own, leaving Milan (but is not sure) the stage of San Siro.
Obviously, the transfer will not happen immediately, partly because the new stadium will be built no earlier than 2013 but not after 2016. So it will be built and will have full functionality in full-term Expo. The dream team to have its own stadium could become reality.
Areas to choose from, there are many (not only the Expo exhibition area Rho-Pero), just that there is near a subway system in order to facilitate the inflow and outflow of supporters who decide to use public transport maybe leaving the car at home and avoiding going to affect the scourge of pollution. There should be a stage too big so that it is always full, partly because compared to Inter Milan this year was 9% in more fans than last year, and should be comfortable.
Ernesto Paolillo, Managing Director, puts his hands forward as regards the vexed issue of residents having already near San Siro complain many hardships during sporting events. The new stadium will not be seen as a nuisance for those who live in the area chosen for the construction. Meazza's experience will serve to avoid bringing in the new field the same mistakes, and will aim to provide the service area, which is lacking at the San Siro.
The president Massimo Moratti announced that the stadium could bring the name of one partner with whom you work on the project, as happens in England or Germany. For San Siro-Meazza, given the extent of names (it Meazza Giuseppe Meazza, historical player and a small period of Inter Milan), it is possible to make a speech like that.
Speaking of costs, will be around 160 million euros, which will fit easily thanks to the sponsors. However, will be the only way to leave Inter in the red budget, although you will have to wait at least 5 years to do it, time you They patch the accounts.

http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=it&u=http://stadiebusiness.blogspot.com/2009/10/moratti-al-lavoro-per-il-nuovo-stadio.html&ei=xDaPS-fKKYmCNKLz-KwN&sa=X&oi=translate&ct=result&resnum=2&ved=0CA8Q7gEwAQ&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dnerazzurri%2Bstadio%2Bnovo%26hl%3Den% 26rlz%3D1C1CHMP_en-USUS306US308


Moratti to work for the new stadium but the fans do not want to leave San Siro
Inter could build its plant property, along the lines of major European clubs in the area between Park and Trenno Settimo Milanese, close by 'Giuseppe Meazza'.
The Nerazzurri club, as reported today by the newspaper 'Tuttosport', has already had some contacts with the Credit and Sport has commissioned an initial feasibility study to the Sports Investment Group, a company specializing in the creation and development of major sports arenas. There is even talk of a possible opening in 2014.
It seems increasingly certain, then, that the Nerazzurri club wants to have a stadium of its own. And 'since August 2004 that Massimo
Moratti, conquered by the beauty of 'Sankt Jakob' in Basel, has promised the Nerazzurri fans a more modern house. The new jewel Nerazzurri may be entitled to Giacinto Facchetti and Angelo Moratti and should have a capacity of 60,000. Ensured the presence of structures such as shopping centers and restaurants open seven days a week.
To move from planning to the operational, Inter expects final approval of the law on building new sports facilities, fired last week by the Senate, now waiting for the yes of the House.
The only ones not excited about the move are those over Inter, who absolutely do not want to leave San Siro. Also because the logic of the new facilities on the English model also implies a recovery of the presence of families and children to the stage thanks to the greater comfort and beauty of the stands, with the gradual reduction of free zones in the stands. Perhaps not please everyone ... .

http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&sl=it&tl=en&u=http://www.tuttomercatoweb.com/inter/%3Faction%3Dread%26idnotizia%3D6284


Among the projects, dates and areas here is the news on the new Inter stadium
Nicholas Gancikoff SIG provides: "Opening in 2014. Meanwhile, back the idea of building a new plant next to the Meazza
09.07.2009 14.45 by Christian Liotta article read 4739 times
Source: Sport Mediaset - Republic Milan
Between declarations of intent and important news at the institutional level, come good news on one of the future projects that are dear to both Inter, namely the construction of the new stadium to property. A project which is discussed for some time, and for whom today's news comes about two that seem to open an important new window of opportunity to its realization. The first comes from the words of Nicholas Gancikoff, leader of the Sports Investment Group, consultancies club for the construction of new stadiums. Gancikoff interviewed by Mediaset in a special issue dedicated to new stadiums, has said that the Nerazzurri fans should not wait much longer: "With a little 'optimistic, I think that Inter could inaugurate the new plant in 2014 . And then announces: "For the Nerazzurri club, we are designing a futuristic project, a center of entertainment."
The second piece of news if we are even more interesting, but comes from the Palazzo Marino, the seat of the Municipality of Milan, Milan Republic reported that it has resumed negotiations with Inter and AC Milan for the transfer of the San Siro stadium for rehabilitation, with the goal of hosting the Champions League final of 2015, the year of 'own Expo in Milan. But above all, is back in vogue, thanks to the gunfight at the OK League Soccer, the idea of building a new plant right next to the stadium Meazza, where now stands in the Hippodrome. Alfonso explains Cefaliello, representative for the Milan, the Consorzio San Siro: "Our priority is to restructure the Meazza to do to get to the level of European organizations such as shows us the example of Madrid. But, if part of a redesign of the 'area and a change of zoning there was a possibility, it would be foolish to deny that clubs like AC Milan and Inter are not thinking about a new stadium. "
The creation of the new stadium adjacent to the current one when the club was destined to Corso Vittorio Emanuele (Milan, as you would with the ownership of the Meazza) permanently solve the problem giving rise to the area where the new arena, after that, during time have been put forward several alternatives, such Rogoredo, Pear and last cases in temporal order, the Cascine Park in Pioltello. Plus, represents the culmination of the project to upgrade the entire area of San Siro, which starts from displacement, starting next season, fans also for visitors to the third ring of the Inter home matches, so you get new areas for new services, then expanded inside the square and then the area of the trot. News, these which inspire trust: the mechanism for the implementation of the new stadium all Inter could get under way soon.

http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=it&u=http://www.gazzetta.it/Calcio/SerieA/Squadre/Inter/Primo_Piano/2008/10/15/sansiro.shtml&ei=xzePS5mdJIO2Norc2fMM&sa=X&oi=translate&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CAgQ7gEwAA&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dmoratti%2Bstadio%26hl%3Den


Inter, goodbye to San Siro
Moratti will take the stage
Print Article | Send this article | Comments: 287
By the end of the year should get the green light to the project. The model will be the Allianz Arena, home of Bayern Monaco. The new 60,000-seat multipurpose facility should be operational in 2012

MILAN, October 15, 2008 - Massimo Moratti will almost certainly man of great change in the entire house. The way to project a stadium owned by the club is indeed upon us. Everything has already been studied and planned in detail: the okay to funding is expected later this year, perhaps even for early December. Then, if everything were always downhill, Inter San Siro retire from season 2012-2013.
Models - Where to be born the new plant is still a secret guarded jealously by Moratti, though most signs point area Rho-Pero, the area close to highways and served well at the level of underground (red line). There would rise up the Olympic stadium if they went into port Milan's candidacy for the Games of 2000. Moratti wants to avoid building a cathedral in the desert, but in this - regardless of the location choice - can help a lot the recent awarding of Expo 2015 in Milan. A Palazzo Durini you think about a stadium of 60,000 seats, like plants dell'Ajax (Amsterdam ArenA, "five stars" Uefa, over 50,000 seats) and of Bayern Monaco (Allianz Arena, another "five stars" from just under 70,000 spectators). In particular, it seems the home of the Bavarian model of reference of the men of Massimo Moratti, a multipurpose facility with restaurants (from the finest self-service, ending with the classic pub), shopping area and even a nursery where you can " park "the puppets have little interest in the game. Areas of access (under the ticket purchased) are basically three: the boxes for private companies, the VIP area and that for large mass of fans.

http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=it&u=http://ricerca.repubblica.it/repubblica/archivio/repubblica/2004/08/14/moratti-per-il-nuovo-stadio-ha-un.html&ei=RziPS5L2BoTYNtjx0NsN&sa=X&oi=translate&ct=result&resnum=3&ved=0CBMQ7gEwAg&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dmoratti%2Bstadio%2Bnuovo%26hl%3Den%26 sa%3DG


Moratti for the new stadium has a Portuguese model
Republic - August 14, 2004 Page 7 Section: LONDON

A Da Luz in Rozzano, or a José Alvalade in Sesto San Giovanni, and why not, a magnified Sankt Jakob in San Giuliano Milanese. L 'idea revived by Massimo Moratti, the' other night in Basel, is more than a sketch sketched on the napkin. is the confirmation that Inter and Milan at the new stadium we think seriously: iperattrezzato be exploited seven days a week from its modern lines like the two stadiums in Lisbon (the Da Luz el 'Alvalade) much appreciated by Moratti during' European football or as the multi-room comfort rossoblù Swiss opponents' s Inter in the Champions. Gallop 's idea of a new scale of football, waiting - it speaks to September - the expertise of Pirelli Real Estate on the present value of the SIRO and the new project by architects Boeri and boys on the fourth ring, the new commercial area with shops, museums, libraries and gardens that would arise on the 'area of the old sports hall. "Those are just considerations of Moratti - highlights Pierfrancesco Barletta, director and secretary general of Inter Chiamamilano - it is right to look around especially if the price fixed by the city remains so high. We have already guessed where to build: a Rozzano c 'is already an' area with the granting of Buildable for sports facilities. But even at Sixth and San Julian, there are free areas. We are not in step d 'farewell to the old San Siro, points out Barletta, it is certain that the words of Moratti give you a nice acceleration. "On the development of 'present stage we have invested so much - more - and soon the studio will tell us what Boers would cost the fourth ring. But it will be a substantial figure, in addition to 150 million sought by Palazzo Marino. E San Siro, to become usable seven days a week, can only be developed to 'content. Not to mention the suggestion of a brand new stadium, even as an idea. " The Da Luz in Lisbon, just conquered by Greece sample d 'Europe, l' example rebuilt from the ground instead of the old bowl from over 100 thousand seats, it now contains 65 thousand, has cost 110 million euros, includes meeting rooms, swimming pools restaurants, boxes, suites, and fitness center. Palazzo Turati Durini and so do not ask for better. "Certainly if you really believe Moratti - comments Cefaliello Alfonso, responsible for the Consorzio San Siro Milan - this changes a little 'things. Why is self-evident, and we have stressed several times that they should be building a new stadium. But maybe it's just a quip summer to invite the City to lower claims. What is certain is that when we study Pirelli RE in hand we can think of numbers and projects old and new. " In jest, Palazzo Marino does not believe. And not even going to be conditioned by proclamations. 'L' public administration is - replies' s Alderman Sport Aldo Brandirali - a public good is not undercut. it is true that the debate on the value of the stadium, but San Siro is a prestigious, the 'surrounding area ideal for its development. If they want to build a new stadium and have the 'area to do so, go ahead. It will not be another San Siro. " The tug of war for the moment, not reduce d 'intensity. A Palazzo Marino not fear even the 'depletion effect of a stadium without either derby or league or Champions. "Will not remain empty Meazza - insists Brandirali - might as well live like the Saint Denis of Paris, who has his team and is full of events all l 'year." - MAXIMUM PISA

http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=it&u=http://sport.virgilio.it/calcio/nuovo-stadio-inter.html&ei=RziPS5L2BoTYNtjx0NsN&sa=X&oi=translate&ct=result&resnum=4&ved=0CBkQ7gEwAw&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dmoratti%2Bstadio%2Bnuovo%26hl%3Den%26 sa%3DG


Inter leaves San Siro in 2014 will have the new stadium. Photos
It 'started the project for the new facility. Investment of 400 million.

Massimo Moratti is dreaming of a new stadium for his Inter. There is talk of 2014 as the final date for what Moratti wants to become the new home of the 'Inter. The new plant would be built from parts of Pero (North-East of Milan), the area dedicated to Expo and placed between two stations of the new metro line.

COMFORT ALL-L 'idea is to create every possible comfort for fans: a handheld screens to watch the replays of the charter goals of the game, custom seats for subscribed forums and heated. All this could become a reality because from time Moratti ponders leaving San Siro.
The project will be similar to that already developed by Juventus, on the model of compact and multi-purpose stadiums such as the Allianz Arena in Monaco or the Amsterdam Arena property dell'Ajax.

THE NAME - The name of the stadium? Dedication to Giacinto Facchetti symbol in Inter's history. The vision will apply after the final selection of the project promoted by 'Sports Investment Group' among the best teams in the world of architecture.

BEST VISUAL - The capacity, equal to 60-65 thousand posts I with optimal viewing angles from all sides due to the absence of the athletics track. Inside the headquarters of the interaction with the trophy room, the museum and the spaces reserved for the merchandising. Outside parking by 7-8 thousand people, it should be enough on match days.

COSTS - The 400 million, including financing costs: most of the investment will come to 80% by funds and banks, the rest by the shareholder. But with the opportunity to make money right from the presentation of the project with input from the sponsors, especially the one which gave its name to the stadium, and companies who book and box stores. It should result in revenue for some forty million.

http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=it&u=http://forum.ilmeteo.it/showthread.php%3Ft%3D49915&ei=RziPS5L2BoTYNtjx0NsN&sa=X&oi=translate&ct=result&resnum=5&ved=0CB8Q7gEwBA&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dmoratti%2Bstadio%2Bnuovo%26hl%3Den%26 sa%3DG


Moratti and the dream 'special': stage

The anticipation of Il Giornale: Inter ready to move from 2012 to Pero

The future of 'Inter could be something special and for once not talking coach. Yes, because the club via Durini working on a major project. Building a squadron unbeatable be entrusted to Jose Mourinho is the challenge at hand, to play the market. Build something solid to hold as loved all samples is the next step, screening 2012.

San Siro farewell Moratti has in mind a new stadium, to be dedicated to his father Angelo and named after a major sponsor, for obvious reasons of trade. Anticipation exclusively reported by The Newspaper might catch up to the emotion of aficionados Meazza, unwilling to abandon forever the scale of football.

But before we shed tears, look at the portfolio. The English model is there to see. The clubs of our house pulled out more money to tv (at least for now, given that the collective sale of rights from 2010 this will change) compared to the power of the Premier League, but on the commercial front, we have much to learn.

The three magic words are: stadium property. A great investment, but also a great deal (in the photo, the design of the new stadium for Liverpool, curated by the architectural firm HKS). And Moratti, that case is not out of oil, he smelled the business. If the Fair is going to Rho, l 'Inter could go to Pero. The great Milan 's Expo expands hinterland, transferring also the temple in the province of the ball.

Capacity from 60-65 thousand seats, just to the Full house every time. Seven or eight thousand parking spaces, so parking spaces to commuters on Monday morning, taking advantage of the new subway stops. Restaurants galore, from fast food to nouvelle cuisine, shops one after another and no running track, because people who go to the stadium after all the game wants to see. And yet 120-150 sky-box, 800 box-loggia and gallery with personalized services.

That's basically the details of the project, unveiled by Il Giornale. Cost of 400 million, 80% of which comes from banks and finance. Depreciation in ten years, substantial revenues, so as not to be outdone by anyone. Special, l 'Inter's future hopes to have the balance sheet assets.


June 1, 2008

http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=it&u=http://archiviostorico.corriere.it/2008/ottobre/15/nuovo_stadio_tutto_per_Inter_co_7_081015046.shtml&ei=RziPS5L2BoTYNtjx0NsN&sa=X&oi=translate&ct=result&resnum=7&ved=0CCwQ7gEwBg&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dmoratti%2Bstadio%2Bnuovo%26hl%3Den%26 sa%3DG


THE PRESIDENT THE PROJECT
A new stadium for the whole 'Inter's challenge Moratti
The new challenge. Moratti and the stage for the 'Inter

These are days of delicate decisions in the entire house. Before Christmas, the president Massimo Moratti dissolve 's last reserve on the decision to build a new stadium property of' Inter, releasing a project which has begun to think from the earliest days of his presidency. It's been thirteen, but building a stadium in Italy has a number of huge problems, not to mention that Moratti is particularly close to San Siro, where L 'Inter have won a lot. However, despite ongoing work to modernize, the stadium is putting on display all the flaws of a plant that has taken 82 years. It's time to change and Moratti had spoken of explicitly in mid June. Now we have to see if there are the final terms and financing for the construction of the new plant, will pass from the project to the executive. Building a new plant also means tying the Nerazzurri to a company value of real estate, to something solid, which gives economic power to the club no longer tied only to the operations of 'majority shareholder. It is also a way to respond to those, like the leaders Juventus, believes that 'Inter are a rich society, but without a project. L 'goal is to use the' system from 2012-2013, the reference model is the 'Allianz Arena in Munich Monaco where he plays for Bayern, a plant of not more than 60,000 seats, which really represents a turning point in panorama of Italian stadiums of the most ugly and outdated in the world. It remains under wraps the area where the new plant will be built, it is likely to point Area Rho-Pero, which is served by Highways and already earmarked to host the Olympic stadium if he ever became a reality Milan in 2000. A project that could change the face of the city (as demonstrated by the cases of Barcelona and Athens Olympics), crushed by a thousand obstacles. Those that Moratti is determined to overcome this time to give Inter Milan a stage to 'height of the times. Fabio Monti

Fabio Monti

Victory
04 Mar 10, 03:47
The stadium that Moratti is alleged to be in love with:

http://www1.it.uefa.com/MultimediaFiles/Photo/Competitions/StaticContent/66/47/46/664746_w2.jpg

http://www.sportlerin.eu/images/stjakobspark.jpg

http://www.stromonline.ch/uploads/pics/StJakobPark_gross.jpg

http://www.gotickets.com/cached/_images/maintainwidth/521x487/3289d6466a2cd8483042263f956c9f7d/st_jakob-park_stadion-5518.gif

http://colunas.globoesporte.com/files/219/2008/06/st-jakob-park-basileia.jpg

http://www.independent.ie/multimedia/archive/00184/St-Jakob-Park_184165d.jpg

http://www.joggeli.ch/pics/stadion_stjakobpark.jpg

http://sport.ard.de/sp/fussball/news200712/02/img/stjakobspark_dpa_400.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1037/1163164283_a89b456b0f.jpg

http://www.fanline08.at/en/wp-content/uploads/2008/01/basel.jpg

http://www.stades.ch/Basel-StJakobPark-SUI-VEN2006-Stades.ch-16_500x375.JPG

http://leohoenig.com/__oneclick_uploads/2008/07/finnair-stadium.jpg

http://de.academic.ru/pictures/dewiki/83/StJakobParkB.JPG

http://static.panoramio.com/photos/original/10259702.jpg

http://cache.boston.com/universal/site_graphics/blogs/bigpicture/euro_06_12/euro2.jpg

http://www.wayfaring.info/wp-content/uploads/2008/06/st-jakob-park.jpg

CafeCordoba
04 Mar 10, 06:43
Yeah, year figure differs from different sources. But thanks for digging those articles.

2014 is the most mentioned year, so I think we have to go with that. Hopefully Inter is announcing officially something already this summer.

Black&Blue
04 Mar 10, 19:37
The stadium that Moratti is alleged to be in love with:


Well great stadium,but this doesn't mean that the possible new stadium will be something like this,according to latest news it will be something different and innovative than all these european modern stadiums,although the inspirations are Allianz Arena,Old Trafford and Amsterdam Arena.

Luka
30 Apr 10, 18:55
It will help alot to our club, which is in debt and we had read some sorry figures of our club's debt sometime back.:)

We are not in debt !

Moratti is borrowing money from his own company to the club. It's like him borrowing money from himself. This is nothing like borrowing money from 3rd parties.

We have 0 euro of debt.

Pravesh
30 Apr 10, 20:10
We are not in debt !

Moratti is borrowing money from his own company to the club. It's like him borrowing money from himself. This is nothing like borrowing money from 3rd parties.

We have 0 euro of debt.

C'mmon, you are confusing me. :D

I read so many articles saying which clubs are in how much debt bla bla bla ?? I am not good with these terms but ain't it something like that ??

My apologies if I am wrong.

:)

Luka
30 Apr 10, 21:10
C'mmon, you are confusing me. :D

I read so many articles saying which clubs are in how much debt bla bla bla ?? I am not good with these terms but ain't it something like that ??

My apologies if I am wrong.

:)
No worries Pravesh ;)

The situation with Inter is totaly different, to situation of clubs like Roma, Man Utd, Real Madrid so on, and so on. The debt for them, is debt to third parties, that have nothing to do with the club itself, like banks etc.

Also this debt comes with some due time, and some interest of the loan.

The debt Inter has is an INTERNAL "debt". Like I've explained, basicly what is going on here, is Moratti borrowing money to himself. I don't know why, but probably it has something to do with less taxes or something financial.

So instead of Moratti just transferring the money directly to the club, which would be exactly the same thing (in the end), he is borrowing his own money from one of his companies to the club.

This is where those figures of 500, 700 mln Euros of Inter "debt" came from.

In reality Inter has NO DEBT in traditional sense.

ps. Paolilo confirmed it a while ago, when Platini have put us in the "debt clubs" group.


"Inter are not in debt with the banks. Inter, like many Italian teams have had a negative balance, but has always covered itself with capital made available by the club's owners."

Victory
30 Apr 10, 22:08
What Inter's debt really is, is just the net loss after expenses are calculated. We are not making a profit, but our loss is being covered by Moratti himself, not the banks.

Pravesh
01 May 10, 08:28
No worries Pravesh ;)

The situation with Inter is totaly different, to situation of clubs like Roma, Man Utd, Real Madrid so on, and so on. The debt for them, is debt to third parties, that have nothing to do with the club itself, like banks etc.

Also this debt comes with some due time, and some interest of the loan.

The debt Inter has is an INTERNAL "debt". Like I've explained, basicly what is going on here, is Moratti borrowing money to himself. I don't know why, but probably it has something to do with less taxes or something financial.

So instead of Moratti just transferring the money directly to the club, which would be exactly the same thing (in the end), he is borrowing his own money from one of his companies to the club.

This is where those figures of 500, 700 mln Euros of Inter "debt" came from.

In reality Inter has NO DEBT in traditional sense.

ps. Paolilo confirmed it a while ago, when Platini have put us in the "debt clubs" group.

So, it is like that. I always thought we were also in debt but in a legal way though. Our club did defend it back then but I thought they weren't frank then; after all who is frank when it comes to hiding business stuffs.:D
Since when did business running people or politicians become so frank and innocent.

I still hope that you and the comments made by Inter are true. :P

:boogy:

ElCuchu
01 May 10, 08:30
We have LOSSES not DEBTS....huge difference.

Nero Indigo
01 May 10, 09:11
Well now I know because I was a little confused about this whole topic in the first place!

Tonibaloni
18 May 10, 07:54
#10 Inter Milan
04.21.10, 06:00 PM EDT

(€-10/£-9)
Italy

League:
Serie A
www.inter.it
Website Languages: Chinese, English, Italian, Spanish

The Milan rivalry is one of the greatest in sports, rooted in the split of Internazionale from what is now AC Milan in 1908 over the direction of the club and whether it should admit non-Italians. The Nerazzurri's golden era was in the 1960s, when they won three Serie A titles and two European Cups. The UEFA Cup was won three times in the 1990s, and the 2000s has brought four consecutive league titles.

Team Value 1$413 Million
(2009: #14)

Samuel Eto'o
Owner/Major Shareholder:
Massimo Moratti
Chief Executive:
Ernesto Paolillo
Head Coach:
José Mourinho
Club President:
Massimo Moratti
European Trophies:
2 European Champions Cups: 1963-64, 1964-65; 3 UEFA Cups: 1990-91, 1993-94, 1997-98; 2 Intercontinental Cups: 1964, 1965
Domestic Championships:
17: 1909-10, 1919-20, 1929-30, 1937-38, 1939-40, 1952-53, 1953-54, 1962-63, 1964-65, 1965-66, 1970-71, 1979-80, 1988-89, 2005-06, 2006-07, 2007-08, 2008-09
Domestic Cups:
5 Italian Cups: 1938-39, 1977-78, 1981-82, 2004-05, 2005-06; 5 Italian Super Cups: 1989; 2005; 2006; 2008; 2009
Stars:
Cameroon striker Samuel Eto'o, Dutch midfielder Wesley Sneijder and veteran captain Javier Zanetti
Legend of the Past:
A World Cup winner with Italy in 1934 and 1938, Giuseppe Meazza scored 287 goals in 408 games for Inter. A year after his death in 1979, the San Siro stadium was renamed in his honor.
Main Sponsor/Uniform Sponsor:
Pirelli/Nike
Other Sponsors:
Sky, Acer, Alitalia, Samsung, TIM, Volvo


Previous: Chelsea
Next: Schalke 04




Founded 1908
1-Yr Value Chg.
(in $US) 12%


Revenue
$276 Million
Income2
$-14 Million
Debt/Value3
0%
Historical Value
Home Uniform
Black and royal blue striped shirts, black shorts and socks
Away Uniform
All white with black and blue stripe on shirt
Third Uniform
All white with red cross of Milan on shirt
Nickname
Nerazzuri (Black-Blues)
Stadium

San Siro
Capacity: 80,100


Sort List By:

* Rank
* Team
* Country
* Current Value
* Debt/Value
* 1-Yr Value Change
* Revenue
* Operating Income

Tonibaloni
18 May 10, 07:54
acording to forbes :)

Trance
18 May 10, 08:01
a link to the actual page of Forbes: http://www.forbes.com/lists/2010/34/soccer-10_Inter-Milan_340007.html

I don't understand how our club value drastically dropped since 2007? I cannot also understand how JuBentus are worth almost 200 millions more than us? and We have had a negative income?

how teh fcuk are they calculating all this shit? JuBe has played for the past years in a shitty 25k stadium, they have sucked cock in Europe so don't tell me selling shirts compensated for all that.

Victory
18 May 10, 13:36
Revenues and operating income are for the 2008-09 season, converted into U.S. dollars based on June 30, 2009 exchange rates. 1 Value of team based on past transactions and current stadium deals (unless new stadium is pending) without deduction for debt (other than stadium debt). 2 Earnings before interest, taxes, depreciation and amortization, player trading and disposal of player registrations. 3 Includes stadium debt. NA: Not Applicable. All figures are Forbes calculations except for revenues, which come courtesy of Deloitte LLP's Football Money League report.

Syn
13 Jun 10, 13:16
Can someone translate this text (http://www.fcinternews.it/?action=read&idnotizia=21180), especially this part
Dunque è lecito pensare che uno dei big in rosa sia destinato a partire, ma non sarà un'inevitabile follia. Se sul tavolo di corso Vittorio Emanuele non perverrà l'offerta giudicata congrua, le altre si mettano pure il cuore in pace. Non ci saranno regali, nessuna svendita. La decisione di privarsi di almeno un big è figlia del bisogno di fare cassa e alleggerire il rosso del bilancio. Il rischio, infatti, è che le ferree regole dell'Uefa mettano i bastoni tra le ruote dell fuoriserie nerazzurra. Cessioni solo per soldi, dunque, salvo qualche rara eccezione (proposta irrinunciabile), l'Inter non accetterà contropartite tecniche. Al massimo, reinvestirà il denaro ricevuto per sostituire adeguatamente il campione partente. Non avrebbe senso, infatti, utilizzare tutto il compenso ottenuto dalla dolorosa rinuncia.

Stefan
13 Jun 10, 21:57
That was what moratti said. In order to balance the books taking into consideration the new uefa financial fair play rule we will need to sacrifice a champion.

Handoyo
14 Jun 10, 09:33
I hope when Moratti said "champion" he meant "Quaresma."

Universe
14 Jun 10, 14:01
Probably means Maicon by the look of things.

Personally the whole situation disgusts me. We should be keeping our stars. And they should know well enough to know what a fuckhole Real Madrid is.

Luka
20 Jun 10, 10:56
"...with the sale of Maicon".

This is a very popular view (I'm not denying it), especialy with what MM said, and the new financial rule and all, but I'm just wondering: where the hell all the money gone to ?

First, last season, MM didn't spend anything of his own, thanks to Ibrahimovic sale. We came on top even of the budget.

This season, we fuckin win the tripplet, I've read people overbidding eachother of how much Inter earned this season through TV/prize money and all, and now all of a sudden we need to sell Maicon. I'm not a financial expert, but shouldn't our situation be better than last year ?

Some figures just doesn't add up. Last season with 1/8 we were good, but this season with winning the CL we need to sell someone.

This is a mystery to me. If this would be true, what would happen next season if we reach only 1/8 again ? We will be like 50-100 mln in the red, because we didn't win CL ?

Somebody must be punking us.

CafeCordoba
20 Jun 10, 13:21
Time to time, Moratti sets off Inter's losses. Losses which Inter is making every year. Maybe he doesn't want to or can't do that anymore, or at least not that often. Our salary budget is ridiculously big considering the ability to generate money this club has. It is our biggest obstacle financially.

Luka
20 Jun 10, 13:37
We ended up last season in the green. MM didn't have to invest anything, from what we know.

Suneet
20 Jun 10, 14:19
Didnt his company make 533m losses recently?

Maybe they are already running Inter within its means, maybe we are spending the money on a stadium as we will need to maximise our revenue and that seems the smartest investment.

vasilios
20 Jun 10, 14:52
Good conclusion from the current situation. We aren't actually linked to any world class players apart from Mascherano. And it seems we are financing big part of our transfer campaign with the sale of Maicon.

I'm really not happy with the way our market is shaping up. If you figure Maicon and Mascherano will each cost somewhere around 30 mil, it's basically a swap. We're getting rid of the best right back in the world, and one of the few players that can actually get forward and both score and provide the ball to our strikers. And we're getting yet another defensive midfielder.

Bringing in Mascherano isn't too bad if we have right and left backs that can get forward and make up for our complete lack of attacking ability in the center of midfield. If we get rid of Maicon, we lose that and are left only with Santon, JZ, and Chivu, none of which are world class attacking backs. Even if we bring in Kolarov and play Santon/JZ on the right, our fullbacks are still worse than they were this year and our midfield is more defensive.

I just hope Moratti and Branca have something else up their sleeves.

Handoyo
20 Jun 10, 15:49
Luka, maybe it also has to do with the fact that we're getting closer and closer each year to the financial rule that UEFA may implement. Hence, clubs are sorting out their balance sheet in advance.

Luka
20 Jun 10, 17:07
Didnt his company make 533m losses recently?

Moratti will not burden Inter with some debt of outside company. He loves Inter too much.

When we're speaking of Inter, through Ibrahimovic sale, we ended up in green (I think Paolilo said as much last year).

Suneet
20 Jun 10, 17:21
What I meant is that he doesnt have the excess money to spend on Inter because his main source of income is in the red big time.

Luka
20 Jun 10, 17:31
You're right, but he didn't spend on Inter last season anyway, because of the cash we got for Ibrahimovic. So without selling Ibrahimovic, and without any buys we wouldn't be in red as it seems. (it can't be any different in this season comparing to last)

If that's our starting point, we can start counting. On prize money we got at least 20-30 mln more this season than last. Add to that 16 mln for Mourinho, and 18 mln that we will save through his contract. Quaresma sale, Muntari sale, Burdisso sale.

We can easily count 100 mln over here. And I'm not even counting other sources, like revenues (CL gates for 2 more games PLUS the final), like TV money, and other revenues.

Suddenly it seems like we would be better off if we didn' win this tripplet, while that clubs that don't win it are in better possition.

Shouldn't it be the other way around ?

Barcelona was able to spend on Ibrahimovic (100mln worth a deal), Chigrynsky 25 mln, Maxwell 5 mln and Keirson 15 mln. That's almost 150 mln worth spending, and they didn't got this money out of the moon. It was thanks to CL win.

With us, it seems like it is worse this year (while winning everything there was to win) than last year :lol:

I mean What The Hell.

CafeCordoba
20 Jun 10, 19:05
It's not like you make it to be. That previous season is some kind of zero point and we can compare that season and the last season without taking our history into consideration. In previous years, we've made losses in our operation. Those losses have been covered by Moratti himself. Maybe there are still losses (debts) to be covered? My point is that maybe Moratti isn't willing to cover those losses anymore and he wants to use this prize money for that. And now this financial fair play has gathered some credibility during the last season so Moratti is perhaps starting to prepare for that also.

Luka
20 Jun 10, 20:38
This is how our debt works:

1. Moratti decides to buy players X, Y and Z
2. Moratti uses Inter money. If the club doesn't have money we overspend the money from our budget and we end up with a loss in our budget for next season.
3. Moratti is covering the loss, by borrowing money to Inter from one (or more) of his companies. That's how Inter "debt" was created over the years. Moratti is borrowing money from himself to himself. So far I wasn't able to find out what is the purpose of it, but there must be some (most likely some money is saved in this process, unlike a simple donation from Moratti).

If we didn't finish our last season in a red, there was no need for Moratti to invest his own money. I seriously doubt Massimo put any serious money last season, except for maybe those works that were done at Appiano.

CafeCordoba
20 Jun 10, 20:52
Yes and we don't know do we made losses or not. We have to also remember that we are going to lose TV-money (collective bargain agreement in Serie A next season), which has been our biggest source of income.

Generally speaking, Moratti doesn't want to pump that much his money to the club anymore but wants the club to "run" itself. He wants to make Inter more self-sufficient.

Luka
20 Jun 10, 21:09
Yes and we don't know do we made losses or not.

I strongly remember somebody from our management saying that last year was the first year we made a small profit, instead of a loss (meaning MM didn't have to cover the budget loss with his money as he always did). I think it was Paolilo but I'm not sure. Stefan might remember that one.



Generally speaking, Moratti doesn't want to pump that much his money to the club anymore but wants the club to "run" itself. He wants to make Inter more self-sufficient.
I'm aware of that. What I'm pointing at is that last season MM didn't pump much money (if he pumped any at all).

Suddenly this year, with all the extra money we gained (unlike last season), we are (as the story goes) in a position where we need to sell in order to buy.

To me, it seems we were better of last season, which is strange. Sure, we didn't sell a player worth 100mil, but certainly we earned a lot of money thanks to our big success, and through the sale of Jose.

Stefan
20 Jun 10, 21:15
Our Ceo explained somethings in an interview with tutto sport. Should be carefull never know if they twisted words.

He says we plan to break even within 2 years. He says we have improved our financial position but still made a loss. Says on the stadium that we are waiting for a certain law to be passed. Anyone know what law he is referring to??

Says the financial fair play is the only way to go to insure football doesn't follow the financial world.

http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.tuttomercatoweb.com%2 Finter%2F%3Faction%3Dread%26idnotizia%3D21652&sl=it&tl=en&hl=&ie=UTF-8

blackmore
21 Jun 10, 01:47
guys we need to look at some non-footballing situations as well here. no doubt inter as a team would have had a better financial year this year compared to last, just off basis of revenue making, but we must understand the sitution of MM and his other company also.

inter as a football club are slowly getting to a balanced revenue, and MM wants to make them self sufficient. its basic economics here, we need to sell in order to buy, otherwise were is all this excess money going to come from. we cant use what we have made over this season cause that has probably been thrown back into the people/companies that have forked out cash in the first place.

20 years of net loss and then one year of net gains(not saying its inter case) does not suddenly mean we are making money or that we have liquid cash at our disposal. we need to think about the millions that have been pumped in over the years and in fact where that money came from and how we are going to put it back.

for inter this year is the first in a long time that they can put something substantial back to the club, and will not greatly change our transfer perspective, we will still have to sell in order to buy.

Ziyad
21 Jun 10, 06:32
Our Ceo explained somethings in an interview with tutto sport. Should be carefull never know if they twisted words.

He says we plan to break even within 2 years. He says we have improved our financial position but still made a loss. Says on the stadium that we are waiting for a certain law to be passed. Anyone know what law he is referring to??

Says the financial fair play is the only way to go to insure football doesn't follow the financial world.

http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.tuttomercatoweb.com%2 Finter%2F%3Faction%3Dread%26idnotizia%3D21652&sl=it&tl=en&hl=&ie=UTF-8
The law could be about tax breaks for building the stadium or subsidies.Just a guess though.If you remmember there was talk about the govt. helping out teams that build stadiums to bid for the Euros.Problem is that bid failed (i think) because France (another reason to hate them) won that bid.

Black&Blue
21 Jun 10, 07:21
The law could be about tax breaks for building the stadium or subsidies.Just a guess though.If you remmember there was talk about the govt. helping out teams that build stadiums to bid for the Euros.Problem is that bid failed (i think) because France (another reason to hate them) won that bid.
One thing is certain,if Italy won't build new stadiums (with the clubs as their owners) Italy will be surpassed by Germany easily in the next years and probably by France after 2016,this is the priority.

Ziyad
21 Jun 10, 08:06
One thing is certain,if Italy won't build new stadiums (with the clubs as their owners) Italy will be surpassed by Germany easily in the next years and probably by France after 2016,this is the priority.

Revenue wise we are definately surpassed by Germany.Bayern make more than 100% on us when it comes to matchday revenue.They also make 300%+ on us from their commercial revenue streams.Suprisingly we make more than them from broadcasting (115 m to 69.6m for them) but thats going to change with the new tv deal,but maybe CL broadcasting increases for us there..

-These figures are from Deloitte
-in Euros
-from season ending in 2009 so no CL success effect on these figures yet.

Stadium can easily generate another 20m/year.We need to build it fast and do it smartly to shift cost away from the Club as much as possible.

Black&Blue
21 Jun 10, 08:21
Revenue wise we are definately surpassed by Germany.Bayern make more than 100% on us when it comes to matchday revenue.They also make 300%+ on us from their commercial revenue streams.Suprisingly we make more than them from broadcasting (115 m to 69.6m for them) but thats going to change with the new tv deal,but maybe CL broadcasting increases for us there..

-These figures are from Deloitte
-in Euros
-from season ending in 2009 so no CL success effect on these figures yet.

Stadium can easily generate another 20m/year.We need to build it fast and do it smartly to shift cost away from the Club as much as possible.

Sure the comparasion between Bayern revenues and any italian team is "embaressing",but I was talking in general not only Inter,Italy needs a radical change if we want to stay at high levels like we always used to do,I'm sure that something will happen in the next 2 years but the change won't be so quickly (looking also at the italian situation of the moment) in my opinion.

My wish is that Inter will have finally his own stadium around 2015 (Expo year).

CafeCordoba
21 Jun 10, 11:34
I'll move this discussion here.


I strongly remember somebody from our management saying that last year was the first year we made a small profit, instead of a loss (meaning MM didn't have to cover the budget loss with his money as he always did). I think it was Paolilo but I'm not sure. Stefan might remember that one.


I'm aware of that. What I'm pointing at is that last season MM didn't pump much money (if he pumped any at all).

Suddenly this year, with all the extra money we gained (unlike last season), we are (as the story goes) in a position where we need to sell in order to buy.

To me, it seems we were better of last season, which is strange. Sure, we didn't sell a player worth 100mil, but certainly we earned a lot of money thanks to our big success, and through the sale of Jose.


guys we need to look at some non-footballing situations as well here. no doubt inter as a team would have had a better financial year this year compared to last, just off basis of revenue making, but we must understand the sitution of MM and his other company also.

inter as a football club are slowly getting to a balanced revenue, and MM wants to make them self sufficient. its basic economics here, we need to sell in order to buy, otherwise were is all this excess money going to come from. we cant use what we have made over this season cause that has probably been thrown back into the people/companies that have forked out cash in the first place.

20 years of net loss and then one year of net gains(not saying its inter case) does not suddenly mean we are making money or that we have liquid cash at our disposal. we need to think about the millions that have been pumped in over the years and in fact where that money came from and how we are going to put it back.

for inter this year is the first in a long time that they can put something substantial back to the club, and will not greatly change our transfer perspective, we will still have to sell in order to buy.

Yeah, like I said earlier, it's not about just the season 08/09 and the season 09/10, and how well we did in those seasons. It's the big picture. We need to reduce our costs to become self-sufficient. It's not self-sufficiency if we don't make losses in a year when we win the Champions League. We can't win that every year, maybe not in the next five or ten years. To make the necessary transfer we need to sell. Probably Maicon's renewal was just for securing our base (longer contract, RM needs to pay more) and he didn't got the real pay raise. And Moratti is not willing to pay that big salary. He's not going to give Zlatan/Eto'o salaries anymore to anyone. And not even salaries around 8-10m€ per year. It's just too expensive.

When it comes to Paolillo's comments, very promising. He understands that financial fair play is the way to go and Moratti wouldn't have been investing money anyway forever to the club. So only option to keep Inter competitive is to make it generate more money to run itself. And stadium talk is couraging, hopefully the law goes in Inter's favour and the planning can be started as soon as possible. Juventus will be at least couple of years in front, when it comes to enjoying revenue from the new stadium so we need that ASAP.

Suneet
21 Jun 10, 11:50
A lot of our transfers are about salaries as well. Maybe we are paying way too much as wages.

junior55
21 Jun 10, 12:50
I understand the whole idea of the financial fair play but yet i can't see how can our club profit in this by selling maicon..

Maicon has a wage of 4.5 M and is asking for a raise that it is deserved . Honestly i don't think that he wants to get 10M after his raise . Probably his agent wants to get to 6M so the picture in my view is this:
We have a player who is determinant to our team who is being paid 6M (taking in consideration that he recieves the raise)
So we sell him for 30M (gessing) and we buy for 30M mascherano who still wants 6M of wage(by the roumors) and is not determinant for us + leaves an empty space in the Rb spot.....

Honestly where is the profit here because i can't get it. . I would understand to sell eto'o who has a 11M wage and this would be a great step towards wage balance but i don't hear any roumor about him so i'm a little confused about our strategies...

CafeCordoba
21 Jun 10, 13:26
Most probably that is not the case here. Rumors are rumors but like you said yourself, that scenario wouldn't make any sense. And as it's been stated by Inter officials that we need to raise money to make transfers, the money is definitely an issue here. We won't pay 30m€ for Mascherano and we definitely won't pay 6m€ per season to him if we indeed manage to sign him. And maybe Maicon is asking more than 6m€ per season. We don't know these details but we can make logical assumptions that there is something related to money why our management is considering selling Maicon.

Tanel
21 Jun 10, 23:26
Between, I believe UEFA's financial fair play rules are said to encourage clubs to invest into infrastructure etc. So we really must get that spade into the ground for a new stadium ASAP. I cannot wait for the day they announce the new stadium... tho then is the day I have to start getting my money together to visit San Siro.

CafeCordoba
14 Aug 10, 08:37
It's said that we were 154 millions in red last autumn and we have a plan to reduce that significantly.

http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A//www.fcinternews.it/%3Faction%3Dread%26idnotizia%3D25206&hl=en&langpair=auto|en&tbb=1&ie=ISO-8859-1 (http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A//www.fcinternews.it/%3Faction%3Dread%26idnotizia%3D25206&hl=en&langpair=auto%7Cen&tbb=1&ie=ISO-8859-1)

blackmore
14 Aug 10, 08:40
mm trying to reduce it to 30-40m by next season. dont see us signing anyone if thats the case...

Luka
14 Aug 10, 10:10
It's said that we were 154 millions in red last autumn and we have a plan to reduce that significantly.

http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A//www.fcinternews.it/%3Faction%3Dread%26idnotizia%3D25206&hl=en&langpair=auto|en&tbb=1&ie=ISO-8859-1 (http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A//www.fcinternews.it/%3Faction%3Dread%26idnotizia%3D25206&hl=en&langpair=auto%7Cen&tbb=1&ie=ISO-8859-1)
To me they just look for a reason for the fact we probably got the most money we can possibly get in a year, and yet we still wanted to sell Balotelli first before spending.

I honestly think they have no clue. It was said time, and time again, that Inter can't be on red, because we have no loans in outside companys. We only have "loans" through the companies owned by Moratti, and those "loans" were counted once, and it was way over 500 mil, not over 100 mil.

We were never on the red. How it works was this: We spent during the summer, if we ended the financial red in the red, Moratti brought the money, to cover that loss, so that for next season we were cleared again.

Also, having a debt (in banks) is not against Financial Fair play from what I've seen. You can still have 700 mln in debt like Man Utd has, and if it was a problem they would shit their pants right now. The problem in financial fair play is if you take bigger loans that there are allowed (small ones). Having a debt alone, isn't against their rules.

Adjusting to Financial Fair play is to help get more income (through owning stadium, through merchandise) and less expenditures (through less wages as we do for example). Adjusting to Financial Fair play is not getting rid of your debt, unless you pay an interest over time, which would be ridiculous (Moratti paying interest to himself).

CafeCordoba
14 Aug 10, 10:20
How in the hell you have a clue and "they" have no clue? You have really impressing detailed info about Inter's financial situation. You seem to know a lot of this stuff. I'm really impressed.

More seriously, always when someone posts something negative about Inter's financial stuff, you come to the rescue and deny everything that we have absolutely no problems and Moratti covers everything, it's all just fine.

Alessandro
14 Aug 10, 10:23
What is it with this forum lately... Luka getting attacked everywhere lol

Luka
14 Aug 10, 11:02
How in the hell you have a clue and "they" have no clue? You have really impressing detailed info about Inter's financial situation. You seem to know a lot of this stuff. I'm really impressed.

More seriously, always when someone posts something negative about Inter's financial stuff, you come to the rescue and deny everything that we have absolutely no problems and Moratti covers everything, it's all just fine.
Didn't you heard Paolilo who said straight after we being accused of having a debt last year ? What did he say, that how much REAL debt do we have ?

You rather will believe some fuckin idiot writing an article, than a CEO of Inter ? In fact, don't answer that Cafe, because it's a pattern with you.

I don't find this article credible because of what Paolilo said, and you'll excuse me if I'll believe our CEO. It was discussed many times, and by many people, not only me. We don't have a debt in the Madrid or Man Utd meaning of the word, so we can't be on the red. It's as simple as that. If you have other explanation, I'm willing to hear that.


What is it with this forum lately... Luka getting attacked everywhere lol
:P

It's very simple Alessandro. I'm not really a guy who is singing in the direction the flag is waving. Last year during Sneijder saga, was exactly the same, and it's exactly the same with many other stuff. I was Jose biggest supporter, nah... he was just a fanboy. I was biggest management supporter... nah he is just blind and stupid.

You see it's like this: if I at least rumbled on all the shit on Jose and management, like the most people did for years, I wouldn't been called a fanboy. But then again, we won the fuckin treble, so I guess that means, I wasn't exactly crazy to see all those good things that I saw, despite calling me a fanboy.

On the other hand we have for example Cafe who was very big opponent of the management for years, who wasn't a biggest fan of Jose (until just recently), and yet we won the treble. I wonder... which one of us got a better "hunch" basing on history ;)

But it's ok. I'm sure I'll argue with Cafe till death do us apart.

I just can't win ;)

CafeCordoba
14 Aug 10, 12:07
I'm not attacking anyone. I'm just questioning Luka's unconditional stance to this financial situation.

Coasterfreek
24 Aug 10, 15:31
I found this long article to be quite interesting. I suppose this is why the transfer window for Inter hasn't contained any large kind of spending at all. But I was really shocked when reading this.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/442218-the-price-of-inters-success

(I apologize for not putting this in this thread like I did. Sometime I don't always dig deep or back.)

Alcatraz
24 Aug 10, 16:09
Very interesting article,TX for sharing!This would explain the quite mercato.
Man i hope we build our new stadium FAST!!!!!

Stefan
24 Aug 10, 16:18
I merged the threads. Thank you for sharing that article Coasterfreek.

CafeCordoba
24 Aug 10, 16:54
Interesting to read. There is those Paolillo's comments Luka talked about and also Platini's comments how it was Berlusconi, Abramovich and Moratti who has asked to do something (with financial rules).

Paolillo to Inter fans: "Old times are over"

"Moratti spent hundreds of millions for ten years before his team managed to win its first title. Now the era of Moratti the big spender is over."

Luka
24 Aug 10, 17:08
I found this long article to be quite interesting. I suppose this is why the transfer window for Inter hasn't contained any large kind of spending at all. But I was really shocked when reading this.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/442218-the-price-of-inters-success

(To be fair I stopped I think like in the middle)

Anyways it would be good article if not for couple of things, and I could list them all but there's no point I think, since the story is loosing credibility to me with every fault it makes (imo).

a) The guy is using two tables showing different figures, and then basing his opinions about stuff from 2 different tables showing different figures
b) Inter is private company; it is widely known that nobody knows exactly how finances work at Inter, and the most we know (to some degree) is how much Inter earns, not how much it spends
c) There is a phrase in it, that we lost 500 mln in 3 years, while couple paragraphs later the guy is backing up his story by the article which said that during Moratti era we lost 1,15 bilion (that part I don't deny). Moratti era last now about 15 years. If we take 500 mln that we apparently lost in last three years, we would have to loose "just" 650 mln in the 12 years. What made this drastic change all of a sudden ? If anything it should got better not worse, especialy since the times where Moratti spended like 50 mln on one player are long over, and from what I got since the time I've become interista was that this huge spending that Moratti did in his era (close to 1 bilion) was made during his early years, not after Calciopoli. Sure we pay more for players etc. but at the same time TV pays more, and there is more money from UEFA etc.

But lets think about it. This article claims that we loose like a 150 mln EVERY YEAR. That's simply insane. If that was true, no stadium, nothing could help us out from the fair play rule that is coming. How to close a gap of 150 mln every year in 2 years ? Impossible, and from what I remember, MM was talking about Inter becoming self sufficient by the time the rule is implemented.

Let me make one thing very clear. I have no problem with hearing/reading Inter being in trouble financialy, and to be honest I would love to read some from behing the scenes stuff, that nobody in the public knows. But only when it's credible and makes sense. If this article was made by say gazzetta, which would bring some "behind the curtain" figures, then it might be a lot more believable. But when something doesn't make sense it just doesn't. I mean 150 mln in red every year ? That's ridiculous.

It seems more to me, like some guy sat on a chair, got a bunch of graphs from the internet (from different sources) made some conclusions basing on them, and some points.

I also have the small problem that it's NOW. I see so many stories that say something AFTER the fact, not BEFORE it happens. I can bet that he got the idea of this article when he saw that we really didn't buy anybody for a large amounts of money. He would never think of this article say in june.

ps. He has 200 mln last year as a wages for the players. Gazzetta says it's 150 mln. Quite a difference.

http://www.gazzetta.it/Media/Foto/2009/09/03/stipendi/inter.jpg

CafeCordoba
24 Aug 10, 17:36
I'm also curious to know his sources, but I'm so far believing him. Lots of work to be done to get those numbers (probably not exact amounts) so I really doubt he would have done that based on absolutely rubbish sources.

But is that Gazzetta's salary chart some kind of truth to you? How do you know that is correct? Clearly those figures in that chart are net salaries, but I'm quite sure salary budget this Swiss Ramble is talking about is, gross salary budget (since that is the amount what Inter has to pay).

Stefan
24 Aug 10, 17:42
If it was gross salary then the difference wouldn't be just €50 million since the tax rate in italy is about 50% like in england. If the net salary is €150 million then gross/before tax should be €300 million. Not €200 million like the article claims the wage bill was.

Stefan
24 Aug 10, 17:43
If it was gross salary then the difference wouldn't be just €50 million since the tax rate in italy is about 50% like in england. If the net salary is €150 million then gross/before tax should be €300 million. Not €200 million like the article claims the wage bill was.

Coasterfreek
24 Aug 10, 17:49
Every article on B/R has its flaws. I usually write on it to talk about my Oakland Raiders. I remember being initially worried that Inter would pull a "fire sale" or what the 1997 Florida Marlins did after winning it all. Thank goodness we haven't lost anyone outside of people who could disrupt the team. I do think some of the graphs in the chart are legit. You're right Luka about the total payroll of salary being incorrect there. People on B/R often like to jump to conclusions.

Luka
24 Aug 10, 17:54
Coasterfreek, just to be clear, I wasn't attacking you with any of this. I was just discussing the article. Links to articles are always appriciated.


I'm also curious to know his sources, but I'm so far believing him. Lots of work to be done to get those numbers (probably not exact amounts) so I really doubt he would have done that based on absolutely rubbish sources.

Cafe think about it. 150 MLN YEAR BY YEAR.

How are we suppose to make it 0 Euro in 2 years time ?

Even if we built 2 stadiums, and sell our major star every year it would still not be enough. There is simply no way that we are loosing 150 mln every season.

Personaly, I believe we are already even. We're even if we wouldn't need to buy anyone, just to stay with the things as they are. But the "self sufficient" thing that MM said, I think he means, that we will be able to produce some cash for every years transfers. Currently I believe we can't do that (not without selling youngsters/other players), but we're trying to (cutting wages with every passing year, improving in the youth department and then selling some of our youngsters etc).

CafeCordoba
26 Aug 10, 11:46
Moratti is not spending anymore like before.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?sid=ao0r0bh_R50g&pid=newsarchive

Btw, Bloomberg is a respectable financial service (if someone doesn't follow financia world at all).

Stefan, both figures 200m€ and 150m€ are just estimates. It's not that GdS is some Bible who knows exactly the amount of our salary budget. That's why I talked about gross/net. Both figures can go either way to make them match (i.e. 150m€ down and 200m€ up).

Luka
26 Aug 10, 13:18
Now this is definetly a better article, which just basicly focus on the fact that we can't "buy" the success anymore, unlike how Moratti tried 10 years ago. We can't be like 50 mln in the red on some ocasions and Moratti just covering it with his money, like it was before.

Also there are no different figures flying around every second paragraph :P, that helps.

The thing is this however, and always will be: Those figures, even the IlSole, are all speculative figures. We have no way of knowing what exactly is going on in the club from financial point of view. For God sake, we don't even know with 100% certainity what we pay or receive for players, unless the other part of the deal is a public club.

However, the fact that Moratti spended a lot on the club is no mystery, and is well known. The thing is though, that if we'll see how much we spended and how little we received in say 1995-2002 period and then we look at the years since Calciopoli there is no way it is the same. We still were on the red, but no way it was the same kind of amount as before (taking inflation into account).

I think it shouldn't be debatable, that we are in much better spend/receive shape that we were before. First of all, because we don't buy players for 30-40 mln anymore, secondly because we started to focus a lot on youth, and also receive money from selling some youngsters that we didn't considered tallented enough, and third because of our recent success.

William
26 Aug 10, 19:21
We need a new stadium

InteristaLT
26 Aug 10, 19:25
I heard BBilan are building new one only for them?If they have a new one then we need it too...

Ziyad
26 Aug 10, 19:36
We need a stadium badly,that alone will bring in soo much money.The bad thing is that we won't get one done by 2015.

William
26 Aug 10, 19:52
I heard BBilan are building new one only for them?If they have a new one then we need it too...

Really??? I never heard anything about them wanting a new stadium, I thought if they are too tight to buy players then a stadium is a joke for them


We need a stadium badly,that alone will bring in soo much money.The bad thing is that we won't get one done by 2015.

2015? If we get the planning through next week JZ will have it built in a month ;)

InteristaLT
26 Aug 10, 19:58
I dunno if its true about bbilan maybe its a joke.But it would be better if they they get the fuck out of San Siro

William
26 Aug 10, 20:55
I dunno if its true about bbilan maybe its a joke.But it would be better if they they get the fuck out of San Siro

To be honest it would be better if we did because if they stay there then they will still be stuggling financially whereas we will be like look at all of our money generated by the stadio Giacinto Facchetti :P

FrenteAtlético1985
27 Aug 10, 02:36
MY FINANCIAL SITUATION IS MEJOR WHY LA DEL INTER MILANO, PORQUE ME SALE DEL ANO

Nero Indigo
27 Aug 10, 04:12
I dunno if its true about bbilan maybe its a joke.But it would be better if they they get the fuck out of San Siro

I don't understand how you think it would be better if AC Milan gets out of the San Siro!!? So you want us to shoulder the stadium by ourselves? We need to get the hell out of there before it puts this club on a wheel chair. WE DO NOT OWN THE SAN SIRO! The city of Milan owns the freaking stadium. We pay rent and they take a chunk out of our ticket sales. We need to generate our own money, and building a new stadium makes it a sure thing.

DARi0
27 Aug 10, 14:29
I found this article about how we oficially bagged €48,759,000 from UEFA :D


Inter lead 2009/10 prize money list
Published: Tuesday 24 August 2010, 9.00CET

http://www.uefa.com/uefa/management/finance/news/newsid=1517274.html

:crazy:

William
27 Aug 10, 16:48
Thats a great amount of money coming in. Should put it towards the new stadium ;)

DIN011
27 Aug 10, 16:55
I found this article about how we oficially bagged €48,759,000 from UEFA :D



http://www.uefa.com/uefa/management/finance/news/newsid=1517274.html

:crazy:
And yet we can't pay fucking 15M for Masch. :P

CafeCordoba
28 Aug 10, 08:23
And yet we can't pay fucking 15M for Masch. :P

15m€ wouldn't have bagged Masch. He cost £16m + £6m to Barcelona, so in euros about 20m + 7m.

rsz85
28 Aug 10, 09:17
That Gazzetta amounts are net salaries next to the players and the 150 million is a sum gross wage inter have to pay. Just count it.

But since this table was made we lost: Vieira, Quaresma, Toldo, Balotelli, Arnautovic and Krhin and their wages (Net 13,4 ~Gross 26)

So now we can have a ~125million check of annual wages + new players (Castelazzi, Biabiany and Coutinho, but dont think that they earn a lot, i think maximum 3 million together, that's 6 in gross)

So now we can pay about 130 million. +we have the 5 million Benitez instead of the 10-12 (?) million josé.

That's a good way of decreasing the payables.

(We hope there will be much more sales (Burdisso, Suazo, Rivas etc.)

Intermilano90
30 Aug 10, 00:53
I think Moratti revealed something about a new stadium being ready in 2014. We really need a new stadium very badly and stay away from those bastards.

DIN011
30 Aug 10, 00:54
15m€ wouldn't have bagged Masch. He cost £16m + £6m to Barcelona, so in euros about 20m + 7m.
I know, CC, but our offer was 6M + Muntari.

blackmore
30 Aug 10, 00:55
I know, CC, but our offer was 6M + Muntari.

you call that an offer....:D

Intermilano90
30 Aug 10, 00:59
Liverpool are in need of money to cover their debts, and their not stupid like Barcelona to sell and important player like Mascherano for 15mil or less. We are talking a club with more than 300mil pounds of debt. The club itself won't cost that much.

DIN011
30 Aug 10, 01:03
you call that an offer....:D

I call it shit covered in shit with shit filling...I was trying to be polite. :D

achilles
30 Aug 10, 01:44
Inter's future is closely tied to Saras, and they are in a very critical sector (energy), so I don't think we have to be worried too much. They make more than $1 billion in revenue a year, so there is a lot of cash coming through there, but their profits are currently about 5% of that.

Universe
30 Aug 10, 04:40
Inter's future is closely tied to Saras, and they are in a very critical sector (energy), so I don't think we have to be worried too much. They make more than $1 billion in revenue a year, so there is a lot of cash coming through there, but their profits are currently about 5% of that.

If anything, I'm under the impression that Saras is not doing to well..

achilles
30 Aug 10, 05:07
Well, its all relative. Saras had a knockout year in 2009. This could have been because right at the start of 2009 oil prices were very low, so they could have been buying unrefined fuel cheap early in the year and then benefitting from higher prices later in the year.

The bottom line is that Saras can refine something like 110m barrels of gas per year, and currently (the last 6 months) has made $1 per barrel of refined gas. So that clearly is atleast $110m of profit yearly. If they can increase their margins, either by lowering input costs, or increase sales through charging higher prices things look significantly better. They make about $5 billion in revenue yearly, and its not asking too much for a company to make a margin of say 5%, which would equal $250m per year.

Profitability fluctuates obviously, but things don't get much worse than they are currently for refiners because: high input prices, stagnant output prices. Crude is quite expensive, but the demand for gas is lower than the last few years.

In terms of long term outlook, though, the sector is very stable, and esp. in good times, profitable.

CafeCordoba
30 Aug 10, 05:28
Well, Saras didn't give any dividends this year and dividends are the income or Moratti family. And generally the success of saras is irrelevant for the future or inter cause FFP rules restricts the outside money streams to the clubs.

achilles
30 Aug 10, 06:42
For sure, money directly from Saras is forbidden, but of course the sentiment at Saras will affect sentiment at Inter :D

Saras just borrowed $250 m euros about a month ago, and whenever you can borrow that kind of money you are doing alright.

Any way, in terms of the Financial Fair Play rules, as long as it applies to all clubs we are fine. Inter needs to increase revenues, esp. ticket and commercial revenues, but surely success AFTER winning the Champions League is crucial to bolstering the clubs image, and expanding the international fanbase even further.

Even when the rules come 'fully into effect' owners can still contribute $45 m euros (!!!!) as long as it isn't counted as 'debt', but rather equity contributions. That means, the owner won't get repaid by the club for the money borrowed (you will only have the chance to get the money back by selling ownership)

It would be interesting to see how much money clubs like Barca, Real and Man U make from casual fans who buy their jerseys due to their iconic status, because obviously those fans would be fickle, and could switch loyalties. Who needs those kinds of fans??? Apparently the business end of a football club does :D

Luka
30 Aug 10, 07:14
I wonder one thing. If financial fair play rule kicks in... can an owner get money for himself from the club's revenues ? Can an owner treat club like just another source of money for him ?

I doubt MM would do that, and say cover his losses or something with club money, but I was always wondering that. Anybody came into a rule like that reading this fair play shit ? :P

CafeCordoba
30 Aug 10, 08:52
Of course he can. It's owners own business (stakeholder, and for public companies shareholders must get something too). But the bottom line is the club can't use more than what it can generate. Debts and alike can be taken only for improving the business (stadium, training facilities, and stuff), but not for running the club (salaries, operating expenditure, transfer fees).

Antonio2810
09 Sep 10, 09:54
http://www.football-italia.net/sep09d.html


Platini then reacted to Inter’s recent success in reducing the wage bill by 20 per cent.

“It means that they share UEFA’s philosophy and that they have rightly started to modify their strategy. It’s not a coincidence that Moratti has shown his intention to reduces costs to me many times and to invest in the construction of a new privately owned stadium.”

snowforum180
09 Sep 10, 16:25
It would be interesting to see how much money clubs like Barca, Real and Man U make from casual fans who buy their jerseys due to their iconic status, because obviously those fans would be fickle, and could switch loyalties. Who needs those kinds of fans??? Apparently the business end of a football club does :D

Unfortunately those fans pay for C.Ronaldo and messi wages :rollani:

Lenny_and_Carl
10 Sep 10, 13:29
I think Inter would be wise to invest some money into some serious marketing people on board. After reading that blog a few pages back it seems, for a club of our stature, we should really be garnering more money in terms of sponsorships etc. For example, Pirelli have been our shirt sponsor for years and (compared to other sponsors) pay very little for the space. Thats a small start I know, but the sooner Inter get on top of this the better.

The real inspiration for this came from reading the book White Angels- an English writer account of spending time amoungst Florentino Perez and other Real Madrid officials during the first galactico's era. They signed the head of marketing from Sega (or something, maybe Nintendo) and immediately he began making deals which seriously increased the financial standing of the club. So much so that, even though Madrid have been in Barca's shadow on the field, they're still the richest club in the world in terms of sponsorship etc.

CafeCordoba
13 Sep 10, 10:41
Some pleasant news also. Inter have collected fourth most money from revenues in UEFA competitions between 2003 and 2010. Source is some StageUp sports business company.

http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A//www.fcinternews.it/%3Faction%3Dread%26idnotizia%3D27299&hl=en&langpair=auto|en&tbb=1&ie=ISO-8859-1 (http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A//www.fcinternews.it/%3Faction%3Dread%26idnotizia%3D27299&hl=en&langpair=auto%7Cen&tbb=1&ie=ISO-8859-1)

Only thing which is pretty strange is how can Barcelona be there after Inter despite winning the Cup two times in that frame.

Nyall
13 Sep 10, 11:44
Some pleasant news also. Inter have collected fourth most money from revenues in UEFA competitions between 2003 and 2010. Source is some StageUp sports business company.

http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A//www.fcinternews.it/%3Faction%3Dread%26idnotizia%3D27299&hl=en&langpair=auto|en&tbb=1&ie=ISO-8859-1 (http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A//www.fcinternews.it/%3Faction%3Dread%26idnotizia%3D27299&hl=en&langpair=auto%7Cen&tbb=1&ie=ISO-8859-1)

Only thing which is pretty strange is how can Barcelona be there after Inter despite winning the Cup two times in that frame.

And Inter haven't even been significant in the competition apart from next year...

thorn
13 Sep 10, 15:42
and why is Milan placed so low..They have won 2 titles,been runners up and reached semis and quarters during that period.but still they are behind Lyon and Bayern

Luka
24 Sep 10, 11:20
Hilarious stuff. I found a similar layout table of profit/expenses of juve from other blog. Take a look, and see if this isn't funny:

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_jLlqDrcSYeQ/TJsSM41DljI/AAAAAAAACN0/4b0xEGLuwHo/s400/6+Juve+Profit.jpg

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_jLlqDrcSYeQ/THN-Q4S4F0I/AAAAAAAACEk/Zk87A0ZjOi8/s400/3+Inter+Profit.jpg

Lionheart
03 Oct 10, 13:48
Are there any serious talks, perhaps a construction plan for the stadium or is just all rumors as usual? I mean the idea has been around for many years but nothing has happened somehow.

Anyone know where we can find updates on this matter?

By the way, this may have already been posted before, but it's interesting to take a look again:

http://www.forbes.com/2010/04/21/soccer-value-teams-business-sports-soccer-10-wealth_land.html

How the fuck did Arsenal get so rich all of a sudden? AND WHY ARE WE ONLY WORTH 413 MILLION?!?!? WTF?!?

Stefan
03 Oct 10, 14:44
Considering our Ceo has mentioned that they are waiting some law to pass in order to go ahead with the stadium. I reckon its more then just rumors. They just have lots of issues witht he laws and the milan city council...

William
03 Oct 10, 21:51
We need the new stadium as soon as possible, the milan council can go to hell

Bulb
09 Oct 10, 14:31
Arsenal having been making profits of around 70mn pounds an year, since they moved to the Emirates. Wenger never pay over the odds for any player, and he rarely goes in for a player above 30yrs old. In the recent history, he shelled out 15mn for arshavin which is the maximum. And he mostly buys youngsters or other players for less than 10mn.

At least you can take some heart from Liverpool, to see what they had done under Rafa Benitez, and how he has increased the value of the team during his reign.

And what is our current debts?

Stefan
09 Oct 10, 14:45
Arsenal having been making profits of around 70mn pounds an year, since they moved to the Emirates. Wenger never pay over the odds for any player, and he rarely goes in for a player above 30yrs old. In the recent history, he shelled out 15mn for arshavin which is the maximum. And he mostly buys youngsters or other players for less than 10mn.

At least you can take some heart from Liverpool, to see what they had done under Rafa Benitez, and how he has increased the value of the team during his reign.

And what is our current debts?

We have no debts owed to the banks. We owe money to private shareholders but the exact amount isn't public.

German_Interista
12 Jan 11, 16:47
I don't know if this is the best thread to put this link in (i hover between this thread and the thread of our new stadium. maybe, if an admin find a better place, he can shift it :-) )

http://swissramble.blogspot.com/search/label/Inter

It's really readable and gives a view about our financial state, especially with FF coming.

vitomins
13 Jan 11, 17:12
I don't know if this is the best thread to put this link in (i hover between this thread and the thread of our new stadium. maybe, if an admin find a better place, he can shift it :-) )

http://swissramble.blogspot.com/search/label/Inter

It's really readable and gives a view about our financial state, especially with FF coming.


Haha this was posted almost 5 months ago...

http://forzainterforums.com/showthread.php?743-Inter-s-financial-situation&p=591225&viewfull=1#post591225

Stefan
13 Jan 11, 18:09
If the financial fair play rule would be in place right now. We along with milan,chelsea,man city,barca and lfc would be fucked...

http://www.fcinter1908.it/?action=read&idnotizia=16490

CafeCordoba
13 Jan 11, 19:31
Yeah, and look at the numbers. We are right behind ManCity.

So don't be so surprised and angry if our management try to actually save some money and not put it to the market in every transfer window.

German_Interista
13 Jan 11, 21:53
Haha this was posted almost 5 months ago...

http://forzainterforums.com/showthread.php?743-Inter-s-financial-situation&p=591225&viewfull=1#post591225

First of all thanks for switching ;)
Secondly i want to say sorry that i didn't search for a similiar post in this forum. But referring to some users here it's important to remember them about our situation.

CafeCordoba
14 Jan 11, 21:19
First of all thanks for switching ;)
Secondly i want to say sorry that i didn't search for a similiar post in this forum. But referring to some users here it's important to remember them about our situation.

Sorry, but the consensus here is that Inter have no debts and nothing to worry about. We made 100m€ last season with the treble victory and all.

(no, this is not my opinion)

cloudq
14 Jan 11, 21:43
lol, we're ok for the immediate future, due to the treble success but if we're not proactive, we might fall the way of the liverpools of the world.

there was just no way a club the size of inter could've continued down this path without moratti. its great timing that we won the treble when we did

for a few years, we're going to have to downsize and downsize significantly, especially in the wages department. and we're going to find it hard to attract top top names without them coming from south america or the balkins or africa especially if we are to compete with the chelseas, man utds, barcas and reals of the world. either that or we're going to need to tie in wages with footballing results.

we're going to have to go the way of milan and cheap out for a few years and only buy players with marketability or sign them on free transfers, at least until the stadium is built and we're able to receive revenue from non-footballing events.

and i'm totally ok with it, our team is getting to the stage where a total squad rebuild is likely to take place and we need to continually look to produce the next balotelli in order to make this team great, and not only will it foster team sentimentality and loyalty and a further resortment to a pre-moratti team building philosophy where we need to rely on our primavera squad to address the massive financial issues. i honestly think the inter management are up to the challenge of making inter successful financially not just on the pitch

CafeCordoba
14 Jan 11, 22:55
Excellent post. Sums up our near future.

Handoyo
15 Jan 11, 11:03
Cloud, you make an excellent post.

I just hope that Branca & co can continue to do their great job in the transfer market and while being frugal, still be observant and make careful decisions.

For example, selling Ibra and getting the players that brought us the Treble was just the best transfer market by any club, EVER.

We need to continue to spot rising talents like Maicon, J.Cesar, while also identifying undervalued deals like Cambiasso and Lucio. On that second point, :palm::palm::palm: for letting Cassano go to Milan. He was needed to bring spark upfront and was extremely undervalued.

Back on topic, just because we need to be frugal doesn't mean we should take our foot off the gas pedal. As a matter of fact, Branca & co should work harder because they need to improve the team without damaging the club's balance sheet.

==================================================

Transfer market efficiency aside, Inter should also look at the other side of the book: Revenue. It's just a shame that we are competing in Italian Serie A, a league that is just so backwards compared to the EPL. But if Barca & Real Madrid can market themselves despite playing in a less glamorous (I didn't say worse) than the EPL, so must we.

Sokrates
24 Jan 11, 20:07
What I don't understand is...

Inter loses every year something between 100 and 200 Mios.
The salarys are... (?) ~ 150 - 200 Mios
The money we earn by television, marketing, stadium etc. are like 0?

Has somebody exactly numbers, where our problem is?
I can't understand why we make every year this big depts...

Luka
26 Jan 11, 15:26
Well, it's also talked in the media that Inter would be fucked if FFP was already on. So there is this "my theory" which is also talked about in the media (and the famous Swiss Ramble guy). Then there is "your theory" which is pure speculation without any grounds at all. And exactly what is this your theory? That Moratti & co were/are just so stingy they simply wanted to keep the money for some reason?

Which theory really sounds more reasonable?

The truth is, Internazionale will need all the extra money possible to survive when FFP comes. We can't rely on Moratti & shareholder money anymore in that era, can you understand it? We have a stadium project, which will happen eventually, we can't get all the money for that from outside. The money is needed elsewhere, not just in mercato.
There are 2 possible scenarios here:

1. The things ain't as bad as they are projected to be in the media.
2. The things are bad.

In first case, it's clear. In second case, my question would be... why are they that bad ? I mean, it's not like we're Man Utd, and we have 700 mln in loan debts, so that we have to worry about that and about interest. We start every year with 0 ballance, and then (if reports to be true), we end up around 100 mln on the red (if we exclude trebble winning like season) at the end of every year. So my question is, how this happens ?

You might correct me if I'm wrong, but I did math once, and if we assume we spend 125-150mln on player wages, that leaves around 250 mln going somewhere else.

So my question in scenario 2, would be... where this money goes to ?

That's why I asked if any of us (me, you), know exactly the finances of the club, cause all I hear is how deep shit we are, and I wonder how is this possible, considering how much we lowered our wages in recent couple years (big savings), and also how much (not only not loosing money) we EARNED from the transfers this year.

Maybe our directors are getting nice 1mln bonnuses every christmas, who knows :>

nerazzurri4life
26 Jan 11, 15:54
:palm:

how many time do we have to talk about FFP and people not understanding it..
the short of it is, it has nothing to do with debt and all to do with annual/biennial earnings...
so discussin manU's (or Barca or Real) debt is irrelevant, since their INCOME is grossly higher than our income

and sir, if, after all your "deep thought" and "logical thinking" you can only come to the conclusion that player salary is Inter's only/main expenditure, then i'd suggest you READ and LEARN more before even posting about the subject

and no, we don't need to know the EXACT finances of the club to understand why we will be in trouble come FFP. A general understanding of how clubs operate, where they HAVE TO spend money and how they earn money is enough to understand why we are in the red every year on earnings...

CafeCordoba
26 Jan 11, 17:42
We start every year with 0 ballance, and then (if reports to be true), we end up around 100 mln on the red (if we exclude trebble winning like season) at the end of every year. So my question is, how this happens ?

You might correct me if I'm wrong, but I did math once, and if we assume we spend 125-150mln on player wages, that leaves around 250 mln going somewhere else.

You said it yourself. We start every year 0 balance and end up around 100m€ on the red. Now when FFP comes into the play, we can't get back to 0 balance from that -100m€. We can't start with 0 balance the next season if we've made -100m€ last season. Moratti and other shareholders can't cover the loss anymore. That is our problem with FFP.

Luka
26 Jan 11, 17:53
You said it yourself. We start every year 0 balance and end up around 100m€ on the red.

It was hypothetical, as one of the scenarios Cafe ;)

I didn't say, we do. I assumed we do, in one of the two scenarios.



Now when FFP comes into the play, we can't get back to 0 balance from that -100m€. We can't start with 0 balance the next season if we've made -100m€ last season. Moratti and other shareholders can't cover the loss anymore. That is our problem with FFP.
I know. But you focus on the effect, I focus on the cause.

If this ^^^ is true, we're screwed no matter what. We could save 50 mln year after year, and it would still get us in the end.

IF we assume those reports are true, then we are 100-150 mln on the red year by year. I still am trying to figure out, how it's possible. I know we're a big club, we spend a lot on a different stuff, but come on. 125 mln on player wages, and what, like a double of that for the other stuff ? What do we do, Johny Walkerer running instead of water in the hotels we're visiting ? :P

AND lets not forget. Where the logic here ? I mean, if we're loosing 100 mln year by year, you know how many money we would have to save in the vault, to keep it going, after FFP kicks in ? :P

The Wall
26 Jan 11, 17:56
What Inter needs the most when FFP comes in play is their own stadium.

Just look at Arsenal, they are literaly swimming in money and benefiting grossly from the Emirates.

nerazzurri4life
26 Jan 11, 18:05
earnings (net income) = revenue - expenditure

i'm going to use ManU as an example:
ManU's average expenditure is ~ 150mil euro
their revenue is ~ 300mil euro
so their earnings are always in the GREEN

our expenditure would be similar to that (I actually think it is more), but our revenue is MUCH LESS; much less than HALF their revenue

if our salaries alone are 125mil, add in general operating costs, staff (team + support), benefits, youth team investments, charities e.t.c., I wouldn't be surprised if our expenditures, WITHOUT MAKING A SINGLE TRANSFER IN, is in the 175mil region



regardless, it is kinda interesting to see the approach our management has taken on this issue. While there are man ways to try to get your earnings in the green year-over-year, there 2 extreme cases are:
(1) Reduce expenditure (which is what arsenal does)
(2) Increase revenue (which is what barca/real do)

It seems we are going mainly down option 1 for the long term.

Luka
26 Jan 11, 18:07
What Inter needs the most when FFP comes in play is their own stadium.

Just look at Arsenal, they are literaly swimming in money and benefiting grossly from the Emirates.
That's another thing that curious me. I mean, if we're in SUCH a deep shit, and it is a deep shit, when you loose 100 mln AS WE SPEEK, with 1 year before FFP kicks in. I mean, what we gonna do, donate blood, and internal organs to cover this ? :P

So if WE ARE in such a mess, WHAT THE HELL ARE WE WAITING FOR ?!!! Every year we're waiting for the Milano council to pass this ruling to help us with stadium, we'll loose money, and if we are 100 mln in red every year, the more we wait, the more deep shit we'll be in later on.

The Wall
26 Jan 11, 18:10
That's another thing that curious me. I mean, if we're in SUCH a deep shit, and it is a deep shit, when you loose 100 mln AS WE SPEEK, with 1 year before FFP kicks in. I mean, what we gonna do, donate blood, and internal organs to cover this ? :P

So if WE ARE in such a mess, WHAT THE HELL ARE WE WAITING FOR ?!!! Every year we're waiting for the Milano council to pass this ruling to help us with stadium, we'll loose money, and if we are 100 mln in red every year, the more we wait, the more deep shit we'll be in later on.

You need money to build stadium. Lots of money. Arsenal built it by their own money for the great part. So this is probably the reason we are waiting...

AlexInter
26 Jan 11, 18:11
What's the problem with the staidum? How much the rent of Meazza cost?
N4L, a stupid question: The money from sponsors(fe: Pirelli) are included in revenues?

Luka
26 Jan 11, 18:15
You need money to build stadium. Lots of money. Arsenal built it by their own money for the great part. So this is probably the reason we are waiting...
I'm aware of that. But we can wait for it another 5, 10 years and we might still be talkiing about new stadium as we do now.

I believe we already waited long enough. And it's not like the city councill will donate us the whole stadium. We'll just save like what 10-15% maybe ? That is some money like 40-50 mln, but considering we're loosing (apparently) 100 mln every year, not the biggest issue.

nerazzurri4life
26 Jan 11, 18:15
What's the problem with the staidum? How much the rent of Meazza cost?
N4L, a stupid question: The money from sponsors(fe: Pirelli) are included in revenues?

Sponsor money is included in revenue. Sponsor money is also not as much as you think. It's only some mil's a year (5-10mils). At best, sponsor revenue covers 2 players salary..lol

Rent of the meazza costs approx 25mil/year I believe

CafeCordoba
26 Jan 11, 18:21
Luka, we are making around 170-175m€ revenue per year (According to Deloitte Money League). Yes, last year we made probably much more. Which allowed Moratti and shareholders not to increase the capital.

Like n4l has explained here, we don't make enough money to upkeep our squad (salary budget). That is the simplest explanation of our situation.

AlexInter
26 Jan 11, 18:25
That means Moratti can cover our debts. His companies can be our sponsors. Their name can be displayed somewhere on the stadium and pay huge amounts of money.
25mils/year...pretty much.

Sokrates
26 Jan 11, 18:37
That means Moratti can cover our debts. His companies can be our sponsors. Their name can be displayed somewhere on the stadium and pay huge amounts of money.
25mils/year...pretty much.

This is the only one solution for us...

Luka
28 Jan 11, 20:09
Luka, we are making around 170-175m€ revenue per year (According to Deloitte Money League). Yes, last year we made probably much more. Which allowed Moratti and shareholders not to increase the capital.

Ok. So lets say 175, and they say (in all those web reports) that we are on the red around 100 mln.

That means, we spend 275 mln approximatly. Now, our wages are 125-150 mln. 120 now according to GDS.

Now my question:

Where is 150 mln going to year by year ? (and lets not say transfers, cause according to those reports, this is statistic recently, and recently we didn't outspent, quite contrary)

I don't know if those stats brought by N4L are true, but lets say they are, and Man Utd spends (with wages ofcourse) around 150 mln a year. You see the problem ?

Man Utd, a big club like Inter. Don't they have young teams ? Don't they travel, don't they have to pay for maintaining the grounds, and all that ? Their wages also must be at least 100 mln, lets say 100 mln, although I believe it's probably more than us at the moment.

So they spend around 50 mln on things besides wages, while we spent what 150 mln ?

That's my problem, in those scenarios we have from those web "reports".

In the first case, MM is just being too complecent, in second case, our club is wasting money on somethings like motherfucker. We already lowered our wages to a VERY good level I'd say. 120 mln is very good. 20 mln over juve, and 10 mln below milan. This is very good level, but somehow... we still in deep shit.

I wonder HOW. I always figured we're in deep shit (meaning Moratti must be pumping money year after year) because:

a) our club is the club who pays the most to it's players in the world - not anymore, with just 120 mln; Milan is already on top of us, and what about Barca or Real or Chelsea ?
b) Moratti is spending shit loads of money on players - not anymore. This summer we not only spent, we GOT 60 mln, and WE STILL are in deep shit.

I repeat... if we're in deep shit, WHERE ALL THE MONEY IS GOING TO, that we still are like 100 mln in the red year by year

Stefan
01 Feb 11, 07:50
According to gazetta we made a surplus of €29 million in the transfer market.

http://www.fcinternews.it/?action=read&idnotizia=37868

junior55
01 Feb 11, 08:59
Well the more we think we are understanding this ffp rule the more it gets weard when you see a team like chelsea which spends 80M for 2 players in one single day without having to sell anyone .
Of course that english teams recieve higher profits than italians one but the difference can't be so huge. We see italian teams who do only loan deals or split a fucking 15M deal(matri to juve) in 3-4 years and than we see totenham offering 37M for rossi , a.vila offering 30M for bent and as i said chelsea spending 80M in a single day.
No matter how big they revenue from merchandising can be there is no way how a team like chelsea who hasn't won anything last year and probably won't win this year too can afford this signings without creating (or better adding) debts to their account.
And i wonder do they really don't care about that ffp rule or does exist any back up plan/rule that makes only the italians team worry and the others not.

mario.santon
01 Feb 11, 09:18
if we are in loss... to balance the budget.. Pirelli or Saras can pay more for putting the banner on the jersey....

Shaun
01 Feb 11, 10:19
According to gazetta we made a surplus of €29 million in the transfer market.

http://www.fcinternews.it/?action=read&idnotizia=37868

I guess this will help when the FPP rule comes into play.

Suneet
01 Feb 11, 15:04
if we are in loss... to balance the budget.. Pirelli or Saras can pay more for putting the banner on the jersey....

Obviously, our finances will be audited by UEFA.... we cant get away with backdoor tricks like these.

If we could MM would have already arranged that..

rsz85
01 Feb 11, 15:23
if we are in loss... to balance the budget.. Pirelli or Saras can pay more for putting the banner on the jersey....

And other owners or shareholders of Pirelli and Saras will watch how is Moratti pumping the money into Inter?

Not solveable.

rsz85
01 Feb 11, 15:24
Did somebody hear about Gazprom's arrival at Inter (with a "smaller' amount)?

Shaun
03 Feb 11, 23:17
So has there been any word on what MM and Co. plan on doing to raise revenue? I hear building stadiums is outside the FPP rule which might be a good start and is well overdue. I've also heard of other clubs investing in like building hotels and stuff like that.

K.I.
04 Feb 11, 03:29
Well...Pirelli can be considered a sponsor so it may pay us whatever it wants since maybe "another' offer Inter was considering was higher...i am sure as the rule begins to be inforced we will be ready for it.

Aby
04 Feb 11, 12:28
So has there been any word on what MM and Co. plan on doing to raise revenue? I hear building stadiums is outside the FPP rule which might be a good start and is well overdue. I've also heard of other clubs investing in like building hotels and stuff like that.

According to FFP rules, income from non-footballing sources is not counted as revenue. So building hotels and stuff like that WILL NOT help us. Otherwise the easiest option for likes of Chelsea and Manchester City is to merge the club with an oil company and let club losses to be balanced out by Oil Company profits.

As per the respected blogger Swiss Rambler - We have only two ways to match the likes of Real Madrid, Barca and English clubs if we want to attract top quality players (Who undoubtedly will demand top players). One to increase Matchday revenue - which would mean getting our own stadium and second to increase commercial revenue (More shirt sales, More pre-season trip to US, more mid-season trip to middle-east)

Aby
04 Feb 11, 12:37
Ok. So lets say 175, and they say (in all those web reports) that we are on the red around 100 mln.

That means, we spend 275 mln approximatly. Now, our wages are 125-150 mln. 120 now according to GDS.

Now my question:

Where is 150 mln going to year by year ? (and lets not say transfers, cause according to those reports, this is statistic recently, and recently we didn't outspent, quite contrary)

I don't know if those stats brought by N4L are true, but lets say they are, and Man Utd spends (with wages ofcourse) around 150 mln a year. You see the problem ?

Man Utd, a big club like Inter. Don't they have young teams ? Don't they travel, don't they have to pay for maintaining the grounds, and all that ? Their wages also must be at least 100 mln, lets say 100 mln, although I believe it's probably more than us at the moment.

So they spend around 50 mln on things besides wages, while we spent what 150 mln ?

That's my problem, in those scenarios we have from those web "reports".

In the first case, MM is just being too complecent, in second case, our club is wasting money on somethings like motherfucker. We already lowered our wages to a VERY good level I'd say. 120 mln is very good. 20 mln over juve, and 10 mln below milan. This is very good level, but somehow... we still in deep shit.

I wonder HOW. I always figured we're in deep shit (meaning Moratti must be pumping money year after year) because:

a) our club is the club who pays the most to it's players in the world - not anymore, with just 120 mln; Milan is already on top of us, and what about Barca or Real or Chelsea ?
b) Moratti is spending shit loads of money on players - not anymore. This summer we not only spent, we GOT 60 mln, and WE STILL are in deep shit.

I repeat... if we're in deep shit, WHERE ALL THE MONEY IS GOING TO, that we still are like 100 mln in the red year by year


Luka, as in year ending June 2009 we made revenue of around 197m Euros. In year ending June 2010 our revenue jumped to 225m Euros (largely the effect of the treble). In year ending June 2009 we spent close to 180m in Wages 105m in Other expenses. A year later it came down to 152m and 95m. This year wages will be down further to ~125m.

So the amount by which we are in red is decreasing year on year. Year ending June 20 2010 we were in a slight surplus because of profits made in transfer market.

Having said that RMA and Manchester united make over 350m Euros and have similar (slightly more maybe) wage structure. So we are operating on same costs while our revenue is short by almost 100m. That explains why we are getting screwed financially every year.

snowforum180
04 Feb 11, 13:36
A small problem is pirelli they are shareholders and are sponsor, but they dont pay us nearly enough.

Bluenine
04 Feb 11, 20:33
Well the more we think we are understanding this ffp rule the more it gets weard when you see a team like chelsea which spends 80M for 2 players in one single day without having to sell anyone .
Of course that english teams recieve higher profits than italians one but the difference can't be so huge. We see italian teams who do only loan deals or split a fucking 15M deal(matri to juve) in 3-4 years and than we see totenham offering 37M for rossi , a.vila offering 30M for bent and as i said chelsea spending 80M in a single day.
No matter how big they revenue from merchandising can be there is no way how a team like chelsea who hasn't won anything last year and probably won't win this year too can afford this signings without creating (or better adding) debts to their account.
And i wonder do they really don't care about that ffp rule or does exist any back up plan/rule that makes only the italians team worry and the others not.

Thats mainly because their football revenues are much higher than ours, while the wages are not too different... so they can afford a higher yearly amortisation. Also, transfers are amortised over the period of a players contract - so most of Chelsea's big spending when the oil man took over will already be amortised and hence not hit the FFP years.

I think one distinction we need to make is that FFP for the first few years only limits the amount of losses a club can cover through investment... I am pretty sure Chelsea have that angle covered. Its only after 2-3 years of FFP when the rules start getting more stringent... My guess ( I could be wrong) is that Chelsea are amortising their current big transfers spend in such a manner that the hit they take 4-5 years from now is minimal.

Inter have much bigger problems coz our wage bill is pretty large as compared to our relevant revenues... hence our "window of transfer spend" is much, much smaller.

Thats why transfers like this Nagatomo one make so much more sense. Not only did we add a technically gifted player for little cost and relatively small wage, we also opened a new market to exploit commercially (TV and merchandise). This move was a technical and commercial masterpiece by Branca, considering the situation!!

nerazzurri4life
04 Feb 11, 20:42
Not only did we add a technically gifted player for little cost and relatively small wage, we also opened a new market to exploit commercially (TV and merchandise). This move was a technical and commercial masterpiece by Branca, considering the situation!!

completely agree, but right now, it is only potential.

We need to:
(a) still be a competitive/relevant team in the UCL
(b) not leave naga rotting on the bench
(c) we HAVE TO BUY HIM OUTRIGHT!

once we do those things, we'll see some pretty decent $$ from this.
Merchandise alone will be in the millions, especially since from what i understand from my few Japanese friends, Japanese people in general do not like "fake" shit, so will buy legit merchandise.

Tanel
04 Feb 11, 22:29
According to FFP rules, income from non-footballing sources is not counted as revenue. So building hotels and stuff like that WILL NOT help us. Otherwise the easiest option for likes of Chelsea and Manchester City is to merge the club with an oil company and let club losses to be balanced out by Oil Company profits.

As per the respected blogger Swiss Rambler - We have only two ways to match the likes of Real Madrid, Barca and English clubs if we want to attract top quality players (Who undoubtedly will demand top players). One to increase Matchday revenue - which would mean getting our own stadium and second to increase commercial revenue (More shirt sales, More pre-season trip to US, more mid-season trip to middle-east)

What the hell does that money count towards then tho - start collecting up on our bank account and be useless? If we make money from apartments or stuff like that there surely must be a way how we can put that money into the club (as an investment or something)...

And guys... stop comparing us to the little kids favorite teams of Man Utd, Barca or RM. They are two times bigger clubs than us until we find our own Messi's and Ronaldo's that create wide global fanbase combined with constant coverage and lot's of consistent wins. Bayern, Arsenal, Liverpool etc are the one's that we can compare ourselves in capability of making money.

cloudq
05 Feb 11, 04:25
read this on the FFP.

this i guess is a big reason as to why we want to have a stadium built by summer of 2013.

http://www.sportingintelligence.com/2011/02/01/revealed-why-chelsea-dont-fear-uefas-ffp-rules-wages-dont-count-for-first-two-years-010205/

it basically says for the first 2 years (2011/12 and 2012/13), you're allowed to deduct from losses any wages from deals signed before 1st June, 2010.

basically, our wage costs will probably be from players signed from January 2011 (since we didn't sign any players in summer of 2010 (except biabiany etc.).

this is HUGE and gives us time to get solvent, especially with the new stadium arriving in summer of 2013

Luka
06 Feb 11, 14:20
Luka, as in year ending June 2009 we made revenue of around 197m Euros. In year ending June 2010 our revenue jumped to 225m Euros (largely the effect of the treble). In year ending June 2009 we spent close to 180m in Wages 105m in Other expenses. A year later it came down to 152m and 95m. This year wages will be down further to ~125m.

So the amount by which we are in red is decreasing year on year. Year ending June 20 2010 we were in a slight surplus because of profits made in transfer market.

Having said that RMA and Manchester united make over 350m Euros and have similar (slightly more maybe) wage structure. So we are operating on same costs while our revenue is short by almost 100m. That explains why we are getting screwed financially every year.
I appriciate your cool tone.

Can you first tell me, where did you find out those figures? (as well, as how do you know, we're operating on the same figures as Man Utd for instance)

Aby
07 Feb 11, 08:19
I appriciate your cool tone.

Can you first tell me, where did you find out those figures? (as well, as how do you know, we're operating on the same figures as Man Utd for instance)

Read this blog... this is very very interesting

http://swissramble.blogspot.com/

There are articles on all big clubs including Manchester United and RMA. While Man Utd make close to 280m GBP in revenue (or around 380m Euros depending on exchange rates) and RMA has revenue exceeding 400m Euros. Barcelona too is in same range.

All Italian clubs are suffering from lack of matchday revenue, which explains why the clamour for own stadium. Unfortunately our hated rivals aka the Dopers are on track to get their own stadium in 2011 while we are still grappling in the dark.

Aby
07 Feb 11, 08:19
I appriciate your cool tone.

Can you first tell me, where did you find out those figures? (as well, as how do you know, we're operating on the same figures as Man Utd for instance)

Read this blog... this is very very interesting

http://swissramble.blogspot.com/

There are articles on all big clubs including Manchester United and RMA. While Man Utd make close to 280m GBP in revenue (or around 380m Euros depending on exchange rates) and RMA has revenue exceeding 400m Euros. Barcelona too is in same range.

All Italian clubs are suffering from lack of matchday revenue, which explains why the clamour for own stadium. Unfortunately our hated rivals aka the Dopers are on track to get their own stadium in 2012 while we are still grappling in the dark.

Luka
07 Feb 11, 09:54
Read this blog... this is very very interesting

http://swissramble.blogspot.com/

Yeah, I was kinda afraid of that.

I wish somebody had the time, and go through this article step by step, to look for inconsistencies, because when you find one, two, three and more, then the whole article emerges as simple bullshit.

For instance:

"In the blue (and black) corner, Inter’s managing director Ernesto Paolillo has responded that Platini’s claims are excessive and mistaken: “Inter are not in debt with the banks.”

So who’s right? Actually, they’re both wrong. The Professor’s figure is for total liabilities, thus including amounts owed to trade creditors and employees, and is clearly over-stated. However, Paolillo’s claim is also palpably incorrect, as the accounts include €48 million owed to banks – not an enormous sum, but clearly more than zero."

So here we have, a CEO of Inter who says "We have no debts in banks", which is pretty stupid thing to say, unless it ain't true at this point, but here we are suppose to believe a blog, with figures got from only God knows what sources. It was covered from top to bottom. Inter is private company, it doesn't share financial details with the public, so I ask, how the internet blog, can get a detailed information, of the exact amount of bank loans we have.

Obviously I can't say: "Paolilo is telling the truth 100%". I can't because I don't know either. But just think for a second. If you are beeing accused of something... it ain't exactly "the best" method to go and squash the roumors with a lie, cause if somebody picked up on that story and showed that this is a lie, it would look 5x worse than at the beginning.

The blog overally seems like it was written by somebody who is writing the financial books at Inter, and I simply doubt that. I don't doubt Moratti invested lots of money. He deffinetly did. But I believe it's not the case for couple years now. It was deffinetly the case prior to say 2005-2006, but seeing at how much we cut our wages, how much we cut on our transfer spendings, and especialy with FFP approacing, I have big troubles believing at those reports of how much deep shit we are.

Luka
07 Feb 11, 09:54
Read this blog... this is very very interesting

http://swissramble.blogspot.com/

Yeah, I was kinda afraid of that.

I wish somebody had the time, and go through this article step by step, to look for inconsistencies, because when you find one, two, three and more, then the whole article emerges as simple bullshit.

For instance:

"In the blue (and black) corner, Inter’s managing director Ernesto Paolillo has responded that Platini’s claims are excessive and mistaken: “Inter are not in debt with the banks.”

So who’s right? Actually, they’re both wrong. The Professor’s figure is for total liabilities, thus including amounts owed to trade creditors and employees, and is clearly over-stated. However, Paolillo’s claim is also palpably incorrect, as the accounts include €48 million owed to banks – not an enormous sum, but clearly more than zero."

So here we have, a CEO of Inter who says "We have no debts in banks", which is pretty stupid thing to say, unless it ain't true at this point, but here we are suppose to believe a blog, with figures got from only God knows what sources. It was covered from top to bottom. Inter is private company, it doesn't share financial details with the public, so I ask, how the internet blog, can get a detailed information, of the exact amount of bank loans we have.

Obviously I can't say: "Paolilo is telling the truth 100%". I can't because I don't know either. But just think for a second. If you are beeing accused of something... it ain't exactly "the best" method to go and squash the roumors with a lie, cause if somebody picked up on that story and showed that this is a lie, it would look 5x worse than at the beginning.

The blog overally seems like it was written by somebody who is writing the financial books at Inter, and I simply doubt that. I don't doubt Moratti invested lots of money. He deffinetly did. But I believe it's not the case for couple years now. It was deffinetly the case prior to say 2005-2006, but seeing at how much we cut our wages, how much we cut on our transfer spendings, and especialy with FFP approacing, I have big troubles believing at those reports of how much deep shit we are.

//Edit

Here is another example.

Taking ONLY this report alone, there is this table:

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_jLlqDrcSYeQ/THN-Q4S4F0I/AAAAAAAACEk/Zk87A0ZjOi8/s400/3+Inter+Profit.jpg

Lets take year 2009(I believe it's for season 2008/2009 looking at the wages). Ok, so we have 195mln of income, and 305mln of losses including 200mln in wages.

So that gives us, 110mln of losses.

Ok. Assuming I'm very generous here(not taking into account, that our season passes rose, that we got shit loads of money from CL tickets, that PROBABLY our merchendaising got better) lets just cut the wages. We know we have at the moment 125mln of wages. So that's 75mln off. 110-75mln is 35mln.

35mln of loss WITHOUT taking into acount CL prize money from last year, the player sales(60mln alone, so you get 25mln PROFIT already) the ticket money, the merchendise rise and all that.

But somehow... we're still in deep shit.

Like I've repeated for a long time. I have no problem accepting we're in some kind of trouble, but I have a problem believeing those stories, because they just don't add up, and wherever I look I get mixed signals.

Aby
07 Feb 11, 12:12
Yeah, I was kinda afraid of that.

I wish somebody had the time, and go through this article step by step, to look for inconsistencies, because when you find one, two, three and more, then the whole article emerges as simple bullshit.

Sorry I read it with a financial eye, it is hard to find many. Looking from a neutral view I think this is one of the best written articles. I am not saying that what is mentioned is Gospel truth, but the points do seem well researched.



So here we have, a CEO of Inter who says "We have no debts in banks", which is pretty stupid thing to say, unless it ain't true at this point, but here we are suppose to believe a blog, with figures got from only God knows what sources. It was covered from top to bottom. Inter is private company, it doesn't share financial details with the public, so I ask, how the internet blog, can get a detailed information, of the exact amount of bank loans we have.

AFAIK clubs are required to disclose the financial data to FIGC, and it can be accessed by anyone who wishes. So dealings of affiliates are not known to public eye, but rest everything is right.



The blog overally seems like it was written by somebody who is writing the financial books at Inter, and I simply doubt that. I don't doubt Moratti invested lots of money. He deffinetly did. But I believe it's not the case for couple years now. It was deffinetly the case prior to say 2005-2006, but seeing at how much we cut our wages, how much we cut on our transfer spendings, and especialy with FFP approacing, I have big troubles believing at those reports of how much deep shit we are.

Wages are not cut overnight. We have carried a ton of deadwood in wages all these years and the result was that in 2008-09 we were in deep-shit.



//Edit

Here is another example.

Taking ONLY this report alone, there is this table:

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_jLlqDrcSYeQ/THN-Q4S4F0I/AAAAAAAACEk/Zk87A0ZjOi8/s400/3+Inter+Profit.jpg

Lets take year 2009(I believe it's for season 2008/2009 looking at the wages). Ok, so we have 195mln of income, and 305mln of losses including 200mln in wages.

So that gives us, 110mln of losses.

The article had accounts FY ending June 30 2009 BEFORE THE TREBLE. The article also states that had we taken the accounts just a month later we would have reduced losses by 55m (the money we made on Ibrahimovic sale).

That year we were carrying on our books Vieira at 5.5m Adriano at 6m, Mancio (yes he too was getting paid) at 7m, Jose at 11m and Zlatan at 12m Euros all of them net of taxes. Add other overpaid useless players like Quaresma 3.5m, Mancini 3.5m and you see in two years we have removed deadwood player wages by close to 90m. Plus we have replaced players like Cruz and Toldo with less expensive alternatives. This gives the reasons to believe we ARE ON RIGHT TRACK.



Ok. Assuming I'm very generous here(not taking into account, that our season passes rose, that we got shit loads of money from CL tickets, that PROBABLY our merchendaising got better) lets just cut the wages. We know we have at the moment 125mln of wages. So that's 75mln off. 110-75mln is 35mln.


35mln of loss WITHOUT taking into acount CL prize money from last year, the player sales(60mln alone, so you get 25mln PROFIT already) the ticket money, the merchendise rise and all that.


Yes we made profits on players for last two years. But a big club like Inter is expected to be a NET SPENDER on transfers. Last two years were an aberration. Second point was that last season was super good in terms of sporting results, lets face it, we are not going to win CL every season. Nor are you going to make profits on player sales every year.

Last year we had above normal revenues because we had great success. In addition to 2009 revenue we made another 28m due to CL run plus a few more million due to tickets/merchandise. This will not happen every year.

In regular year our revenue will be in range of 210-220m Euros. While our core expenditure (Wages plus Administrative expenses) are in the range of 220-230m Euros. In short we still are not not making good.

Last two seasons we have been balancing this out by making money on transfers, which again for a club like Inter is NOT SUSTAINABLE.

What happens if you want to invest in the squad? what happens if you want to increase the wage slightly because you want to sign a superstar?



But somehow... we're still in deep shit.

Like I've repeated for a long time. I have no problem accepting we're in some kind of trouble, but I have a problem believeing those stories, because they just don't add up, and wherever I look I get mixed signals.

We are on right track, however the problem is that our days of big spending are gone unless we find a way to increase income (new stadium)

Luka
07 Feb 11, 19:28
AFAIK clubs are required to disclose the financial data to FIGC, and it can be accessed by anyone who wishes. So dealings of affiliates are not known to public eye, but rest everything is right.

If financial data to FIGC from Inter can be accessed by anyone, why Gazzetta, or any other paper is not making financial reports of clubs every season, or every 6 months?

They are printing the wages every season, so why not other details? I'm sure many would be interested, and if not, it's a good story anyways, and good filler of the pages.

As for the rest... I kinda lost the track, of what our argument is about (?) When you first talked to me, what was the main thing you wanted to discuss with me?

nerazzurri4life
07 Feb 11, 20:57
lol

luka will only believe "we're in shit" if moratti gives luka a copy of the bills in his hand, and then luka calls the bill collectors to verify that the bills are indeed valid :P

Luka
09 Feb 11, 10:38
No. I will believe most things, as long as they make sense.

Don't spread shit, like others from your band.

chipschups
10 Feb 11, 06:58
okay,,i believe we're on the right track now,,
new stadium will solved our problem


completely agree, but right now, it is only potential.

We need to:
(a) still be a competitive/relevant team in the UCL
(b) not leave naga rotting on the bench
(c) we HAVE TO BUY HIM OUTRIGHT!

once we do those things, we'll see some pretty decent $$ from this.
Merchandise alone will be in the millions, especially since from what i understand from my few Japanese friends, Japanese people in general do not like "fake" shit, so will buy legit merchandise.

agree,,
bring more japanese in here,,:D

CafeCordoba
10 Feb 11, 07:47
Excellent posts by Aby trying to convince Luka. :)

The thing is exactly like he says. We've made couple good seasons now (last season and this season most probably), but it's not gonna continue like that forever. We won't win treble every season, we won't win Scudetto in every or even every other season when Juventus catches the top of Serie A with their stadium. And we can't sell super star every season, or if we do, our competitiveness suffers.

The best question for you Luka and your suspiciousness is that why is Inter balancing their books this season? (last season wasn't planned, Zlatan sale and treble) Why on Earth is the management doing it if we don't have financial problems?

Paolillo can say all kind of stuff in the public, to make Inter look better and shit, but we know Italians, we know these corporate executives generally, they don't tell you the truth always. The truth is Inter/Moratti has been involved in initiating the FFP idea at the first place with UEFA/Platini. And now we've been executing the actions to make "Inter FFP-friendly". Recude the costs, reduce them by all means necessary since we can't generate extra revenue out of nowhere. Generating revenue is a long process so reducing the costs is the easier path at this point when we have problems with City of Milano to get the license to build the stadium.

Ario Interland
10 Feb 11, 08:48
Is it clear when exactly we would play in our own stadium? Is there a solid plan at all?

beneamata
10 Feb 11, 10:03
If financial data to FIGC from Inter can be accessed by anyone, why Gazzetta, or any other paper is not making financial reports of clubs every season, or every 6 months?

They are printing the wages every season, so why not other details? I'm sure many would be interested, and if not, it's a good story anyways, and good filler of the pages.

As for the rest... I kinda lost the track, of what our argument is about (?) When you first talked to me, what was the main thing you wanted to discuss with me?
I want to know this too. I mean, you spread a picture of some incomes and expenditure from a blog(bold and italic), you don't know the man(or kid maybe?), and don't know how much about that is true.
So instead of believing blind in those "facts", try to think with your own head.

Cut, cut, cutting... until when? We just can't cut the wages of players until they get 1mil per year. They play for a treble team, they should be paid like the other players in big clubs.

We can just increase the income, the new stadium is one of the few solutions, there aren't many solutions out there.

CafeCordoba
10 Feb 11, 10:51
Deloitte Football Money League 2011 is out.

http://www.deloitte.com/assets/Dcom-UnitedKingdom/Local%20Assets/Documents/Industries/Sports%20Business%20Group/UK_SBG_DFML2011.pdf

There we can see that 62% of our last season's revenue came from TV-deal. From this season on (like said in that report) Inter won't have own TV-deal anymore, but there is the collective TV deal for Serie A clubs. Which means our main revenue source is providing us less money (private deal was of course bigger than the what the collective provides) this season and in the future (well, at some point Serie A might become so popular that we can get as much money from the collective deal as from the old private deal, but that will take many many years).

Bottom line is, we don't generate enough money to maintain a squad full of super stars. That's why we don't buy super stars but an inexpensive talents who don't demand too much salary. When people get this, it's much easier to talk about squad building.

Luka
10 Feb 11, 12:10
The problem here Cafe, is that many people have different opinion about us and FFP. So if for instance, I talk with Aby, he has his own perspective. When you cut in, I have to immidietly change my approach, cause your opinion also (I think from our discussions) differ.

I never doubted that we were/are in a minus, I never believed we're as cool(in revenue) as say Man UTd, or Real. I never said... hey, we can go spent 100mlns year by year, fuck FFP.

ALL I'VE SAID since this stupid report in this blog was made, is that it just doesn't add up(AT THE MOMENT IT WAS PUBLISHED), cause it claimed, we're loosing 100mln year by year. And to THAT I had objection. That is why I constantly say "reports claim we still in deep shit". Are we?

We just focused on the wages ALONE, and we already are down to 35mln. What about other cuts, like administrative cuts? What about increse in revenue(not due to CL prize money etc), but due to the fact that Inter became more popular, that winning CL will have impact in future years? What about increse in the season tickets for Inter?

So, 35mln minus (basing on this report), plus incresead revenue, is closing us close to the level of 0, which is what I never denied.

I denied, that we are TODAY STILL on -100mln year by year, I denied that we're STILL in "deep shit" and it is obvious we're not.

Now take this our current ballance(according to that report, either way), that is I think closer to 0 than to 35mln.

Now ADD all the transfer money we had... add the CL money we got... add all the other extra revenues, that all comes in total of (probably more) around 100mln.

This is why I was so pissed at MM for not spending any of it. When I've said... why we can't spend SOME of it for reinforcments(it's not like we're gonna have a year like that every season), you guys go... well because of FFP, and we're in such a deep shit and all.

Well, we're not. It's obvious, it's clear. We can't be(cause if we were, how do you make -50 or more dissapear over 2 years?). Maybe we're -5, maybe we're -10, -15... but it's deffinetly not in the regions of -50 or -100mln as some reports/people want me to believe.

So this was the possibility a) for me. The other possibility, was that WE ARE in such a deepshit (still -50 or more), and in THIS CASE... this is clear that something is VERY WRONG with our expenses, and that we have a huge leak somewhere.

Do you understand what I'm saying?

I'm not arguing against us being on the red. I was always arguing against us being DEEPLY on the red, like over 50mln every year.



The best question for you Luka and your suspiciousness is that why is Inter balancing their books this season?
I'm not sure I follow you? Can you extend it, and be more specific? (also some example wouldn't hurt, so I understand fully what you're saying)

nerazzurri4life
10 Feb 11, 17:23
No. I will believe most things, as long as they make sense.

Don't spread shit, like others from your band.

you my friend have some real issues, seeing that the JOKE flew over your head

"band"?? wtf? is this high school or something?
my band v your band??

hahahahahahaha

seriously dude.. :palm:

Luka
10 Feb 11, 19:02
you my friend have some real issues, seeing that the JOKE flew over your head

Can you blame me?

Can you blame me that I didn't take it as a joke? Knowing your issues with me, knowing our past arguments, how our "discussions" look like, and my/your position about this particular issue? Well having 2 options jeer/joke, I'm sorry that I took more probable one to me.

If it was a joke, I take it as one, and the case is closed.

il Biscione 84
10 Feb 11, 21:49
Interesting Article on the financial aspect of the top european clubs...

http://www.goal.com/en/news/1717/editorial/2011/02/10/2345824/football-money-league-analysis-italian-clubs-are-losing-up

Empty Stadiums Costing Serie A Clubs

Matchday Revenue 2009-10
(% of Total Revenue)

http://i.goal.com/web/goal/2010112304-rev10820/images/flags/three-letter-code/ITA.gifItaly
Milan: €31.3m (13%)
Inter: €38.6m (17%)
Juventus: €16.9m (8%)
Roma: €19m (16%)

http://i.goal.com/web/goal/2010112304-rev10820/images/flags/three-letter-code/ENG.gifEngland
Man Utd: €122.4m (35%)
Arsenal: €114.7m (42%)
Chelsea: €82.1m (32%)
Liverpool: €52.4m (23%)
Man City: €29.8m (20%)
Tottenham: €44.9m (31%)
Aston Villa: €29.8m (27%)

http://i.goal.com/web/goal/2010112304-rev10820/images/flags/three-letter-code/ESP.gifSpain
R Madrid: €129.1m (30%)
Barcelona: €97.8m (25%)
Atl Madrid: €35.9m (29%)

http://i.goal.com/web/goal/2010112304-rev10820/images/flags/three-letter-code/GER.gifGermany
Bayern: €66.7m (21%)
Hamburg: €49.3 (34%)
Schalke: €25.4 m (18%)
Stuttgart: €30.2m (26%)

Serie A TV Rights Revamp Will Prompt Change

Broadcast Revenue 2009-10
(% Of Total Revenue)

http://i.goal.com/web/goal/2010112304-rev10820/images/flags/three-letter-code/ITA.gifItaly
Milan: €141.1m (60%)
Inter: €137.9m (62%)
Juventus: €132.5m (65%)
Roma: €65.6m (53%)

http://i.goal.com/web/goal/2010112304-rev10820/images/flags/three-letter-code/ENG.gifEngland
Man Utd: €128.0m (37%)
Arsenal: €105.7m (38%)
Chelsea: €105.0m (41%)
Liverpool: €97.1m (43%)
Man City: €66.0m (43%)
Tottenham: €62.9m (43%)
Aston Villa: €63.6m (58%)

Summarizes the document Cafe attached...

cloudq
10 Feb 11, 23:25
the accounts say on a non-treble winning year, we are losing ~100 million a year. we're in the red ~35 million due to player wages alone. its not that big of a stretch to believe another 65mil is being spent on running the club, ie stadium rental, management, medical, etc.

there are steps being taken to lower the wage bill, there are steps being taken to increase revenue (stadium, marketing overseas) but it doesn't happen overnight, inter really dropped the ball in terms of marketing themselves overseas. there is a perception (not completely unfounded) that we play a secondary role to milan in terms of entertainment.

again, steps are being taken, and yes winning a CL means there is a 100 million dollar injection of cash, but we can't count on going deep into the knockout stages each and every year.

we should and we should be striving to get deep into the CL every year because it builds inter as a brand, but in reality, we can't.

hence the stadium, hence the shrewd purchase of nagatomo, hence the systematic lowering of the wage bill, hence the focus on youth products.

but it doesn't happen overnight.

-100 mil in the red has to become -30 mil in the red in 3 years time.

i don't mention the FFP straight away because of the article posted on the previous page.


read this on the FFP.

this i guess is a big reason as to why we want to have a stadium built by summer of 2013.

http://www.sportingintelligence.com/2011/02/01/revealed-why-chelsea-dont-fear-uefas-ffp-rules-wages-dont-count-for-first-two-years-010205/

it basically says for the first 2 years (2011/12 and 2012/13), you're allowed to deduct from losses any wages from deals signed before 1st June, 2010.

basically, our wage costs will probably be from players signed from January 2011 (since we didn't sign any players in summer of 2010 (except biabiany etc.).

this is HUGE and gives us time to get solvent, especially with the new stadium arriving in summer of 2013

Aby
11 Feb 11, 04:10
ALL I'VE SAID since this stupid report in this blog was made, is that it just doesn't add up(AT THE MOMENT IT WAS PUBLISHED), cause it claimed, we're loosing 100mln year by year. And to THAT I had objection. That is why I constantly say "reports claim we still in deep shit". Are we?

I thought the blog was CLEAR as anything. We lost 150m in 2008-09 the year BEFORE THE TREBLE. It never claimed that we are losing that much every year. In fact the blog was so clear that had the accounts stated one month later our losses would have come down by 55m. Simple thing to understand.


We just focused on the wages ALONE, and we already are down to 35mln. What about other cuts, like administrative cuts? What about increse in revenue(not due to CL prize money etc), but due to the fact that Inter became more popular, that winning CL will have impact in future years? What about increse in the season tickets for Inter?

Yesterday Deloitte released its figures. In a year we won the treble we increased our revenue from 197 to 225 m Euros. A measly increase of 28m euros on a year with super success. You want us to believe that it will continue forever? Delusional I would say. In a normal year without treble, our revenues will fall down. There will be less number of matches broadcast, less stadium tickets sold and low overall revenues.
Now if in your opinion if Deloitte is also a rag, then nothing much to add.



So, 35mln minus (basing on this report), plus incresead revenue, is closing us close to the level of 0, which is what I never denied.


I think it is easy to understand Simple maths. The level is 0 due to two things - mega profits from Ibra sale, and extra revenue from treble. Remove the two (Which will not happen in a normal year) and you are STILL IN A LOSS.



I denied, that we are TODAY STILL on -100mln year by year, I denied that we're STILL in "deep shit" and it is obvious we're not.

We are not -150 which we were two years ago. But 45m profits on Ibra, 30m extra revenue due to treble, 75m of saved wages we break even. Of the three only the wage part is permanent. The rest will not happen every year. Remove that and we are back in red by more than 50m. Isn't that being in shit.


Now ADD all the transfer money we had... add the CL money we got... add all the other extra revenues, that all comes in total of (probably more) around 100mln. again is it going to happen every year. No sane fan believes in scudetto every year, leave alone a treble.



This is why I was so pissed at MM for not spending any of it. When I've said... why we can't spend SOME of it for reinforcments(it's not like we're gonna have a year like that every season), you guys go... well because of FFP, and we're in such a deep shit and all.
Give that guy a break. He has subsidized us by more than half a billion euros over 15 years.

snake
11 Feb 11, 04:16
hey abi,

asl?

b4h4mooth
11 Feb 11, 05:06
Broadcoast revenue

Milan: €141.1m (60%)
Inter: €137.9m (62%)
Juventus: €132.5m (65%)
Roma: €65.6m (53%)

England
Man Utd: €128.0m (37%)
Arsenal: €105.7m (38%)
Chelsea: €105.0m (41%)
Liverpool: €97.1m (43%)
Man City: €66.0m (43%)
Tottenham: €62.9m (43%)
Aston Villa: €63.6m (58%)

this is interesting how come italian tv broadcasting beaten the number of BPL broadcast revenue ... MU have a lot of fansbase all over the world beside madrid...

plus BPL now is the best league in the world(in terms of marketing)...if this data come out at 90, i will believe it since seri A is superior that time

correct me if im wrong?

.h.
11 Feb 11, 05:51
Yesterday Deloitte released its figures. In a year we won the treble we increased our revenue from 197 to 225 m Euros. A measly increase of 28m euros on a year with super success. You want us to believe that it will continue forever? Delusional I would say. In a normal year without treble, our revenues will fall down. There will be less number of matches broadcast, less stadium tickets sold and low overall revenues.
Now if in your opinion if Deloitte is also a rag, then nothing much to add.

This is the first time I#ve posted on this website in many years.

I'm disgusted at how so many people can screw up so many basic things.

1 - The only clear summary you can make is:
a - Inter's revenue SUCKS. Once the TV broadcasting change is in place, we are about 150m a season behind where we should be. That includes a significantly increase in merchandising and gate receipts from our own stadium
b - Putting these into place are the only chance we have of surviving in FFP realistically, and being able to spend what we make from revenue and not just transfers
2 - The Deloittes accounts DO NOT mention transfer fees, so our books for year ending 31 MARCH 2011 will be inflated by quite alot because we recieved money from the Ibrahimovic sale.


If you don't believe me, why don't you go and read the actual thing. Its only 40/50 pages long, readily available on the internet for download, and then people can actually inform themselves and not make up BS about what the books mean :)


Its available here:
http://www.deloitte.com/view/en_GB/uk/industries/sportsbusinessgroup/sports/football/deloitte-football-money-league-2011/index.htm

Luka
11 Feb 11, 10:56
I thought the blog was CLEAR as anything.

I don't want to go back to that blog, how they got their figures and all that, so lets leave it behind, and just focus on our current situation, since this is what interests me, not some blog. Especialy since it's not valid anymore, seeing it dealt with the period <June 2009.



Yesterday Deloitte released its figures. In a year we won the treble we increased our revenue from 197 to 225 m Euros. A measly increase of 28m euros on a year with super success. You want us to believe that it will continue forever? Delusional I would say. In a normal year without treble, our revenues will fall down. There will be less number of matches broadcast, less stadium tickets sold and low overall revenues.
Now if in your opinion if Deloitte is also a rag, then nothing much to add.

I think it is easy to understand Simple maths. The level is 0 due to two things - mega profits from Ibra sale, and extra revenue from treble. Remove the two (Which will not happen in a normal year) and you are STILL IN A LOSS.

Listen to me, ok?

According to that report(since you believe it, lets take it as point of refference), in a year ending with June 2009, we had 150mln of losses? Ok.

Take out the transfer dealings.35mln, that leaves us with 115. Now there are wages for 205mln. If we play with believing those reports, we can as well believe gazzetta(in fact I believe them more), that has our summer wages for 125mln. This is 80mln cut. So we take 80mln out of 115, and you have 35mln.

These 35mln, are:
- without the sale of Ibrahimovic taken into account
- without the transfer money of 60mln in plus in 2010
- without the extra prize money we got from UEFA for the CL winning year
- without the incresead revenue for 2009/2010
- without any other cuts(administrative and so on)

You're saying like I think our revenue went up to 225mln and it will stay that way even if we won't do anything in CL this year. Ofcourse not. I'm not an idiot. But it won't go back to 195mln level either, will it now? Our trebble winning season will affect our revenues, because of increseaded interest, and although it probably will not be 225mln, it will be somewhere in beetwen, and I wouldn't be suprised if next year it was closer to 225mln, than to 195mln.

So it's not hard to believe, we are way past the -30mln line. Even if we assume, that we will take 50% of that increased revenue as for keeps, and the other as the extra that happened due to Trebble year, we're already past -20, which can almost in full be covered(untill we'll gain on revenues) by the owner as far as I remember. Not to mention the fact, that we are earning some portion every year from our deals including the youngsters.

But let me be pessimist here, and say it's -35, and the owner can't cover that loss.

So far so good?

Now you take this:
- 60mln from player sales
- huge increase in UEFA prize money
- increase in match tickets due to the fact we reached semifinals
- increase in TV money due to the CL winning season
- increase from other revenue sources(merchandise and so on)

100mln plus is really not so crazy idea to think, is it? Probably was even more, since just transfers plus increased revenue give us 90mln. I'm even good and leave all the Ibrahimovic extra behind.

-35mln plus 100mln, gives us what?

beneamata
11 Feb 11, 12:28
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_jLlqDrcSYeQ/THN-Q4S4F0I/AAAAAAAACEk/Zk87A0ZjOi8/s400/3+Inter+Profit.jpg
BUSTED!

Forbes (http://www.forbes.com/lists/2010/34/soccer-10_Soccer-Team-Valuations_Rank.html) is saying:
Season 2008-09 Inter had -14mil. Operating income (this blog picture is saying 111 millions)

Forbes vs Some blog picture

It's up to you guys

La Brujita
11 Feb 11, 13:21
If the Swiss Ramble which is held in high regard by various websites is not reliable why are you guys reliable? It matches numerous things including the Diolette money league.

Seriously, just cause you don't like the fact doesn't mean it's not true. We are in deep shit and when you call a 12 million Euro transfer a "sacrifice" you're in very deep shit.

blackmore
11 Feb 11, 14:21
Despite growing revenue by €28.3m (14%) to €224.8m (£184.1m) and winning every competition that they entered in 2009/10, Internazionale remain in ninth place in the Money League. Whilst the increase in revenue saw Inter surpass their compatriots Juventus and close the gap on Liverpool in eighth position to less than €1m, the Nerrazzurri will be most disappointed in being overtaken by their city rivals AC Milan.

On the pitch, Inter, under the management of the selfproclaimed ‘Special One’, created history during 2009/10 becoming the first Italian side to win the Scudetto, the Coppa Italia and the UEFA Champions League in a single season.

This success generated matchday revenue of €38.6m (£31.6m), a €10.4m (37%) increase on 2008/09, the highest of all the Italian clubs, yet still only the twelfth highest overall. Matchday revenue still only accounts for 17% of the club’s total revenue and will need to be grown further if Inter are to climb higher in the Money League. Plans were announced to redevelop the San Siro as part of Italy’s UEFA Euro 2016 bid, however as the bid was unsuccessful it remains to be seen if the renovation plans will still go ahead.

Inter’s 2009/10 broadcast revenue increased by €22.2m (19%) on 2008/09 largely owing to the victorious Champions League campaign, which earned the club €48.8m in UEFA central distributions, compared to €28.3m in 2008/09.

The €137.9m (£112.9m) of broadcast revenue generated in 2009/10 is the fourth highest amongst Money League clubs, only bettered by the Spanish giants, Barcelona and Real Madrid, and their city rivals AC Milan. As with their neighbours, Inter will face challenges in maintaining this level in 2010/11 given the return to collective selling of Serie A broadcast rights.

Commercial revenue in 2009/10 decreased by €4.3m (8%) to €48.3m (£39.6m) owing to a reduction in both the revenue received from the club’s kit supplier, Nike, and the value received from general club sponsors, partially offset by a €3.8m increase in the club’s shirt sponsorship deal with Pirelli. Despite the €13.1m and €13.8m received from Pirelli and Nike respectively, Inter’s 2009/10 commercial revenue was only fourteenth highest amongst Money League clubs.

In 2010/11 Inter have already added the Italian Supercup and the FIFA World Club Cup to their bulging trophy cabinet, but the departure of new manager Rafael Benitez after just six months in charge and a disappointing first half of the domestic season leaves the club with plenty to do if it is to emulate its achievements of 2009/10 and climb higher in next year’s Money League.



http://www.interfanclub.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/UK_SBG_DFML11_charts_Internazionale.jpg

1. Real Madrid 438.6m euros
2. FC Barcelona 398.1m euros
3. Manchester United 349.8m euros
4. Bayern Munich 323.0m euros
5. Arsenal (http://www.soccerticketsonline.com/arsenal-football-tickets/) 274.1m euros
6. Chelsea (http://www.soccerticketsonline.com/chelsea-football-tickets/) 255.9m euros
7. AC Milan 235.8m euros
8. Liverpool 225.3m euros
9. Inter Milan (http://www.interfanclub.com/inter-milan-tickets/) 224.8m euros
10. Juventus 205.0m euros
11. Manchester City 152.8m euros
12. Tottenham Hotspur 146.3m euros
13. Hamburg 146.2m euros
14. Lyon 146.1m euros
15. Marseille 141.1m euros
16. Schalke 04 139.8m euros
17. Atletico de Madrid 124.5m euros
18. AS Roma 122.7m euros
19. Stuttgart 114.8m euros
20. Aston Villa 109.4m euros

Deloittes..

Aby
01 Mar 11, 10:42
According to that report(since you believe it, lets take it as point of refference), in a year ending with June 2009, we had 150mln of losses? Ok.

Unfortunately it is not just the blogs. Our cross town rivals and the Cheats of Turin do taunt us on the same unfortunately



Take out the transfer dealings.35mln, that leaves us with 115. Now there are wages for 205mln. If we play with believing those reports, we can as well believe gazzetta(in fact I believe them more), that has our summer wages for 125mln. This is 80mln cut. So we take 80mln out of 115, and you have 35mln.

While the wages have been cut, it is not as drastic



These 35mln, are:
- without the sale of Ibrahimovic taken into account
- without the transfer money of 60mln in plus in 2010
- without the extra prize money we got from UEFA for the CL winning year
- without the incresead revenue for 2009/2010
- without any other cuts(administrative and so on)


Aren't the first two points redundant. Do the math again. Our net spend in 2009-10 was close to 0. Yes we made tons of money on Ibrahimovic. We also spent a lot on buying Miltio, Sneijder, Motta and Lucio. Net spend close to zero.

I don't know where the 60m figure you are getting from.

Second point was on the fact that we got extra money from UEFA because we were super successful. We are NOT GOING TO BE THAT successful this year.



You're saying like I think our revenue went up to 225mln and it will stay that way even if we won't do anything in CL this year. Ofcourse not. I'm not an idiot. But it won't go back to 195mln level either, will it now? Our trebble winning season will affect our revenues, because of increseaded interest, and although it probably will not be 225mln, it will be somewhere in beetwen, and I wouldn't be suprised if next year it was closer to 225mln, than to 195mln.

Actually it might be closer to 195 because of two reasons. One we lose 6-8m from the new TV deal. We lose about 20m if we get knocked out by Bayern Munich.



So it's not hard to believe, we are way past the -30mln line. Even if we assume, that we will take 50% of that increased revenue as for keeps, and the other as the extra that happened due to Trebble year, we're already past -20, which can almost in full be covered(untill we'll gain on revenues) by the owner as far as I remember. Not to mention the fact, that we are earning some portion every year from our deals including the youngsters.

Again, as a big club we are expected to be net spenders. If we are making losses of around 30m (or whatever number you agree upon) where will the money for one big signing come from. Unless we start disposing off of our best players.



But let me be pessimist here, and say it's -35, and the owner can't cover that loss.

So far so good?

Now you take this:
- 60mln from player sales
- huge increase in UEFA prize money
- increase in match tickets due to the fact we reached semifinals
- increase in TV money due to the CL winning season
- increase from other revenue sources(merchandise and so on)

Again you are talking of non-existent things. First of all the 60m itself is incorrect. Second the money which we got from UEFA is not a permanent source of revenue as we will not be coming every year.



100mln plus is really not so crazy idea to think, is it? Probably was even more, since just transfers plus increased revenue give us 90mln. I'm even good and leave all the Ibrahimovic extra behind.

-35mln plus 100mln, gives us what?

It give you fuzzy George Bush math :)

Luka
16 Mar 11, 13:23
It give you fuzzy George Bush math :)
No, it gives us +65mln in THAT YEAR(the one I'm complaining we didn't spend), and that is with PESSIMIST scenario.

This is mostly according to YOUR source, which you brought here, not mine, on the digits from THAT report.

We had +65mln last year, with the very pesimistic scenario, the money which we could spend in big portion, and how did we utilise that money that year?

Only ignorants like you, who like to throw doomsday stories, like it's 2002 again, want to believe we're still in "deep shit", and can't spend big portion of our money we received after winning Trebble.

I never said the following btw:
- We definetly ain't on the red anymore
- We CAN spend 50mln+ every year

What I DON'T believe is:
- We are in "deep shit" (meaning over 50MLN in the red every year, some probably still think we are -150mln every year), from those calculations we're -35mln basing that on the 2009 year, not trebble year, which means we can be very well under 20mln in the red
- We can't spend big portion of the money in a trebble year for needed reinforcments because we need to cover our "deep shit" problems, which as I pointed out above is not possible(based on your report) unless someone believes 20mln or less is "deep shit" - the owner can cover a loss like that if I remeber correctly under new FFP regulations btw; if we can't spend in the trebble year, I wonder when can we spend?



Second the money which we got from UEFA is not a permanent source of revenue as we will not be coming every year.

You understood NADA, from what I've said. ZIP. This line, and couple others prove that.

And seeing how I'm not as often here as I used to, I'm sorry, but I won't waste this limited time, on discussing this with you, seeing as you can't accept somebody discussing the report you focused on in certain way. I guess, you only like when somebody believes the doomsday stories, and if not...

ps. "While the wages have been cut, it is not as drastic". Ofcourse not. I mean otherwise your "doomsday" stories wouldn't hold its ground would they? :) After all WHO IN SANE MIND would believe Gazzetta wage figures, if they have some internet blog around the corner.

CafeCordoba
18 Mar 11, 11:12
Btw, financial point of view getting to the next round in CL was very nice. Every victory and passing round is important. So far we've earned 16,3m€ from UEFA revenua distribution for getting to quarter-finals and playing as we played in group-stage. On top of that comes the TV-money from the marketing pool.

CL prize money so far:

Participation: 3,9m€
Group stage matches: 6,1m€ (3 wins, 1 draw, 6 matches)
Getting to the knockout stage: 3m€
Getting to the quarter-finals: 3,3m€

TOTAL: 16,3m€

http://www.uefa.com/uefa/management/finance/news/newsid=1528290.html

vasilios
20 Mar 11, 02:48
So getting to the quarterfinals basically canceled out Suazo's wages :lol:

Luka
20 Mar 11, 11:53
Btw, financial point of view getting to the next round in CL was very nice. Every victory and passing round is important. So far we've earned 16,3m€ from UEFA revenua distribution for getting to quarter-finals and playing as we played in group-stage. On top of that comes the TV-money from the marketing pool.

CL prize money so far:

Participation: 3,9m€
Group stage matches: 6,1m€ (3 wins, 1 draw, 6 matches)
Getting to the knockout stage: 3m€
Getting to the quarter-finals: 3,3m€

TOTAL: 16,3m€

http://www.uefa.com/uefa/management/finance/news/newsid=1528290.html
It deffinetly is, because it should give us opportunity to use even more money from Treble year(which we already used partialy on Pazzo and Frog). More money from CL, means we're closer to 0 in the red region, than to 35mln region, which is important, even if it's just for a year.

CafeCordoba
20 Mar 11, 14:59
And extra 4,2m€ if we beat Schalke. So it would make 20,5m€ CL prize money alone.

Luka
20 Mar 11, 16:23
And extra 4,2m€ if we beat Schalke. So it would make 20,5m€ CL prize money alone.
Yup.

My personal belief is that we're already close to 0mln region. I mean how long our people were talking about FFP, and about "prepparing" for it and all. If they did, than they must have set some goal for it - 0mln on the red with say 1/16th round of CL min. I believe we'll reach it when the FFP kicks in. From the "figures" study, of those shady reports it seems it's te case.

And if IT IS... and we get 100mln+ from a trebble year, than when if not in THAT year we should expect us to buy some players?

This year though, definetly will boost our financial situation even more. One major signing is deffinetly doable. Those Trebble money are still there somewhere, and from how things look, there might not be something big to cover our losses for this season.

CafeCordoba
21 Mar 11, 10:02
Paolilla again talks about FFP. He says it's not turning back anymore and Inter will not spend "important figures".

http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=fi&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.fcinter1908.it%2F%3Faction%3Dre ad%26idnotizia%3D20383

I think this is a planned thing. That Inter personel keeps telling time to time about FFP and how we can't spend that much anymore, so that the fans will finally understand the crazy years are truly over. It's no turning back to the old anymore.

Luka
21 Mar 11, 10:21
Sure those days are over, very true. But by "those days" we mean spending 50-100mln in one summer, and make Moratti to cover like 150mln loss, or spend 30mln on one player, and Moratti to cover at most 20-30mln?

I personaly don't expect us to spend 50-100mln year by year. Is it crazy to expect some spending, on the best financial year in Inter's history? :>

Also there is second issue. Are we talking about "those days are over" in terms of "there is no money for major signings unless we sell", or in terms of "the players value is overestimated, but we can easily spend if there is good opportunity"?

The difference is this: If Messi was up for sale tomorrow for 60mln, in case a) we wouldn't buy him, in case b) we would.

Personaly I don't buy this "aura" of "we're in deep shit" made by some fans, and some portals/sites. Take notice all Paolilo/Moratti said was that we need to adjust to FFP, that we won't spent crazy figures, but that doesn't mean we don't have the money to spend if we only would like to.

Just my 5 cents.

CafeCordoba
21 Mar 11, 10:44
I think the case is the a). We won't buy any player for 60m€, for 50m€ or even 40m€. 30m€ might be in our reach, that sum we could invest to a player who would be a sure hit. Unfortunately no player in 30m€ region is a sure hit, since those players are in 40m€+ region.

I'm doing nothing but following exactly what Moratti and Paolilla has talked about AND what our club has done for the last 2 summers now. What is our net spending per year for the last two years? IMO what these two have talked and what our club has done correlates very much together.

By saying deep shit, it's just that we won't buy big names anymore and we can't afford to give massive contracts to our players who have turned to big names (namely Zlatan and Maicon in our near history). Big names cost over 30m€, unless we can get Sneijder/Eto'o-type deals, that's the only way. It's just the interpretation of what this club has done in the last two years (and in that time the FFP has come to this discussion).

Luka
21 Mar 11, 11:55
I think the case is the a). We won't buy any player for 60m€, for 50m€ or even 40m€. 30m€ might be in our reach, that sum we could invest to a player who would be a sure hit. Unfortunately no player in 30m€ region is a sure hit, since those players are in 40m€+ region.

Whether it's 60mln, or 50, or 70mln was not my point ;) My point was to differentate the cases. In one, we don't have certain amount of money, in the other we have, but the price must also be not overmade.



I'm doing nothing but following exactly what Moratti and Paolilla has talked about AND what our club has done for the last 2 summers now. What is our net spending per year for the last two years?
We didn't spend much. But it can be for 2 reasons. a) we don't have money, b) we believe other teams are not yet living in FFP times, and value players too much.

You believe it's case a), while I believe it's mostly b), especialy with the money from trebble year.



By saying deep shit, it's just that we won't buy big names anymore and
Agreed here. But big names mean around 50mln+, and I don't believe anybody of us expect that, or even demand. But big name player, and a player worth 25-30mln is a big difference imo.

CafeCordoba
29 Mar 11, 06:28
Pajo just think about it logicaly. It seems that no matter the year/age, Inter financial situation is bad/we're in huge debt. Sometimes I think that 10 years from now, I will still hear the same story(unless our situation will change drammaticly).

Couple years back we had 225mln of salaries, and now we have according to La Gazzetta 125. We have the best years in terms of income from the tickets, and then comes the best commercial years, the most merchendising money, the most money from prizes, from TV.

And we're still in "very bad" situation.

I do agree, we can't spend 50 mln every year on players, that's for sure. But it's not like pappa Moratti has to spend 100mln every year to cover our losses, like it was in 90s. Even with those shady "swiz blog" numbers, we were AT LEAST +65mln last year after the trebble. And this is very, very, very pessimistic scenario. We already surpassed expectations by reaching 1/4 of CL, and we miht very well reach semi finals.

We ain't Barcelona, or Bayern, we can't spend 50mln without any extra income, but we can if we get 100mln+ from winning the trebble, that's the point. This money was a huge income, and we spend like 1/3 of it till now. The 2/3 to spend would be a little greedy, but 1/3 we can still spend, PLUS the overincome we'll get this year. Plus the sales (hopefully Pandev, Muntari), some youngsters dealings etc. etc.

Luka, like Pajo said (http://forzainterforums.com/showthread.php?8523-Alexis-Sanchez/page53), the extra money from last season is "gone". It isn't anymore in our "extra money pool", it has been used or budgeted already. It isn't as straightforward as you say express it. That we've used 1/3 of that money so we can afford to use other 1/3 of that money and we still have 1/3 of that money for other expenses.

The most probable scenario is that with that money, we covered the costs, which Moratti & co normally cover by themselves. And next summer we have a certain money budgeted for transfers + money from possible sales. Then if Moratti wants to pump the money to the club for the last time, he can do it in this summer. That way we go in minus with net transfers. And I mean over our transfer budget.

And my guess is our transfer budget is around 20-25m€.

Azzkikr
29 Mar 11, 10:10
:wallbang:

We didnt have 65m€ in profit from last season. Were do people even get this stuff from.

Our revenue only increased 10% from the 08/09 season and in the 08/09 season we ended up with a 14m€ Loss. Now it doesnt take a genius to figure out that unless our revenue is astronomically big there is no chance in hell that we could ever go from -14m to +65m with only increasing the revenue 10%.

On top of that of that im pretty sure our wage budget was increased in the 09/10 since players like sneijder, milito, motta, eto'o, lucio all have reasonably high wages and we failed to get rid of much of the dead wood.

Its not just to piss people off that Moratti and Branca kept saying we "had to sell to buy", they werent joking. Inter makes minimal profit each season so they need to sell their players to buy new ones. We made minimal profit last season, but atleast we made a profit. This season we should make a slight profit as well, but not likely more than 10-15m€.

We have gotten rid of practically all of the dead wood this season though, but we will first see the result of that in 2012.

cloudq
29 Mar 11, 12:24
i have a feeling luka (reading this thread) simply refuses to see that inter as a club were losing massive amounts of money on a yearly basis, and that we were somehow solvent amidst all the crazy spending.

some cold hard facts:
1. we are solvent because moratti has been propping inter up with saras oil money and has been for 2 decades.

2. we only really (finally) turned a profit because we won the treble. non-treble years = heavy losses

3. just because we finally made money, doesn't mean we're going to spend it either just for the sake of spending it. heck we bought ranocchia for 19 mil total FFS and pazzini for 19mil + biabiany

4. this is only the beginning of cost cutting measures, inter is going on an extreme diet and aiming to become a lean, mean financial machine. even then, at the very least, we are aiming to cut our losses by more than 50% (from a non-treble year) to at the very least, 45mil loss p.a.

5. until we build that new stadium, we cannot and will not buy that one world class player per season, we are going to have to content with our current batch of overpaid champions and 17-20yo primavera academy products/buys

6. it really is that dire a situation. FFP regulations only finally necessitated a long overdue need to become a properly run organisation.

nerazzurri4life
29 Mar 11, 12:35
here's what I said earlier:


lol

luka will only believe "we're in shit" if moratti gives luka a copy of the bills in his hand, and then luka calls the bill collectors to verify that the bills are indeed valid :P

everybody understands, but luka just doesn't believe it, so it makes no sense trying to convince him otherwise

Pajo
29 Mar 11, 13:01
not everybody... me and another macedonian member of this forum (Syn) were trying to convince people that we are in bad financial situation, and they keep saying Moratti this, Moratti that, and keep comparing us to the EPL clubs and Barca/Real... :palm:

KardiacKid
29 Mar 11, 13:35
:wallbang:

We didnt have 65m€ in profit from last season. Were do people even get this stuff from.

Our revenue only increased 10% from the 08/09 season and in the 08/09 season we ended up with a 14m€ Loss. Now it doesnt take a genius to figure out that unless our revenue is astronomically big there is no chance in hell that we could ever go from -14m to +65m with only increasing the revenue 10%.

On top of that of that im pretty sure our wage budget was increased in the 09/10 since players like sneijder, milito, motta, eto'o, lucio all have reasonably high wages and we failed to get rid of much of the dead wood.

Its not just to piss people off that Moratti and Branca kept saying we "had to sell to buy", they werent joking. Inter makes minimal profit each season so they need to sell their players to buy new ones. We made minimal profit last season, but atleast we made a profit. This season we should make a slight profit as well, but not likely more than 10-15m€.

We have gotten rid of practically all of the dead wood this season though, but we will first see the result of that in 2012.

Nobody should believe anything that they read regarding Inter's financial situation. Not even information put out by Inter. The truth is that nobody on this board - or outside of the organization - has any clue what Inter's true profits were for last season. And Inter isn't going to open up their books and show their true audited financials for anybody outside the organization...not even UEFA. Accounting profits and true profits are completely different things. A good owner/president/general manager can make $5 million profit look like a $5 million loss on paper.

Think about your own tax returns. My tax returns don't show my true earnings from last year. It's called creative accounting; and businesses/corporations are fantastic at hiding money. The Florida Marlins (MLB) just did this in order to get their new stadium financed largely by tax payer dollars - instead of having to pay for most of it themselves.

CafeCordoba
29 Mar 11, 14:06
3. just because we finally made money, doesn't mean we're going to spend it either just for the sake of spending it. heck we bought ranocchia for 19 mil total FFS and pazzini for 19mil + biabiany


Excellent post. Don't get angry even if I point out this single mistake, since the post was great and this is just a tiny detail. Detail is we paid 12m€ + Biabiany for Pazzini and ~14m€ + Destro (half or full, that I don't know) for Ranocchia (Moratti's words).

CafeCordoba
29 Mar 11, 14:18
Nobody should believe anything that they read regarding Inter's financial situation. Not even information put out by Inter. The truth is that nobody on this board - or outside of the organization - has any clue what Inter's true profits were for last season. And Inter isn't going to open up their books and show their true audited financials for anybody outside the organization...not even UEFA. Accounting profits and true profits are completely different things. A good owner/president/general manager can make $5 million profit look like a $5 million loss on paper.

Think about your own tax returns. My tax returns don't show my true earnings from last year. It's called creative accounting; and businesses/corporations are fantastic at hiding money. The Florida Marlins (MLB) just did this in order to get their new stadium financed largely by tax payer dollars - instead of having to pay for most of it themselves.

Yeah, and FFP is coming exactly to this. When FFP rules are in effective on its full, clubs can't use money to salaries/transfers more than what they earn. So if we have earn 15€ each year, we can use 15€ for salaries and transfers. We can't take 10€ loan or take 10€ donation just like that, if we are going to use that 10€ for salaries or transfers. We've taken those donations for over a decade now from Moratti when he and other key shareholders have covered the losses of the club. When FFP is on, it isn't possible anymore.

It doesn't matter if the club can hide some of the true profits since those can't be used without being exposed as you can only use the accounting profits for running costs, not the true profits.

Stadium projects, youth academy investments and such are different matter, they are not the running costs of the club so for those you can take loans in FFP. Of course there will be some shady business within these rules but as Moratti has been one of the key figures getting this FFP thing implemented to UEFA, FC Internazionale is surely taking FFP seriously.

cloudq
29 Mar 11, 14:41
Excellent post. Don't get angry even if I point out this single mistake, since the post was great and this is just a tiny detail. Detail is we paid 12m€ + Biabiany for Pazzini and ~14m€ + Destro (half or full, that I don't know) for Ranocchia (Moratti's words).

yeh, i knew the 19mil figure jumped out at me 12mil + biabiany (7mil valued) = 19mil

and im fairly sure it was 12mil (for half), we paid 6mil in the summer for ranocchia's first half (18mil so far...) and im fairly it was a destro loan to genoa that we gave up with a first option to co-own, hence 19mil

CafeCordoba
29 Mar 11, 14:54
Moratti said himself it was 14m€ (I can try to find that interview somewhere, it was in this month or the previous, I'm pretty sure) and counterparts. In the media it (Frog's other half) was first said to be 12-13m€ in cash but it has been said otherwise later.

Destro is officially on loan at Genoa atm, but what I interpret the situation, Destro will go to Genoa in the summer (full or part) and Genoa "pays" 5m€ for that, and that makes our cash part of the deal 7-8m€ (Frog's other half), which effectively makes it 13-14m€ in cash + Destro (full or half) for Ranocchia. Of course we haven't paid the full amount of the transfer fee still, so Genoa don't have to pay us anything, they just take Destro (full or half).

rockball
29 Mar 11, 15:32
Shame on all of you here. Wait till Luka comes and shows Inter's balance sheet and all account details to prove you wrong.

cloudq
30 Mar 11, 04:17
well we can't really count the cash until its in our bank account yet.

just like if sunderland decides to reneg on muntari

DARi0
30 Mar 11, 13:34
Please, for anyone who knows, WHEN IS THIS FFP rule coming on?

Because this could be the key to all our answers! If Moratti can STILL invest money NOW [don't care if it's from his pocket or from our club finances], we will get wonderkids for the future - like Sanchez & Ganso. It's the greatest possible investment! Think about it. It's not like spending 65m for Torres :wallbang2:

gesi-ny
30 Mar 11, 17:21
It already started but will be enforced on 2014-2015 season. Basically, if by 2014 any team is on red based on last three years then it is "the boulevard of broken dreams". Starting 2012 UEFA will keep a close eye on break-even requirement for each club...meaning you cannot spend more then what you earn.

Sokrates
30 Mar 11, 20:20
Would it make sense to buy now for hundred of millions new young players, that we have a good patrimony in the future...?

gesi-ny
30 Mar 11, 20:26
I guess. If they turn out to be Eto'o, Messi...etc, yes. If not then we need to find someone else to fund Moratti :). But, yes this FFP rule will give priority to young players. Who has better scouts and manages the players well will do good. Another reason why we need Leo on our club.