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Thread: 2019/2020 Midfielders Rumours Thread

  1. #721
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    Quote Originally Posted by brehme1989 View Post
    I guess Mancini > Ancelotti too.

    P..S. Do we consider that Ancelotti shouldn't be accounted for seasons 2004-5 and 2005-6? Or if we do, shouldn't wr consider that they'd probably win those as well if the league wasn't tainted?

    Ya, if Mancini won his without all the stuff that happened off the field, then I would say he was better too. Unfortunately there will always be a big fat * next to his Serie A wins, so no I do not think he is better than Ancelotti.
    Quote Originally Posted by brehme1989 View Post
    This season is unfortunately a 5 season setback. We were 1.5 mercato away from becoming a top team, now won't really have expectations of winning an important trophy until 2025.

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    Quote Originally Posted by vitomins View Post
    Ya, if Mancini won his without all the stuff that happened off the field, then I would say he was better too. Unfortunately there will always be a big fat * next to his Serie A wins, so no I do not think he is better than Ancelotti.
    The counter to this is, both Juve and Milan were implicated in the calciopoli scandal. So on a fair league Mancini would've probably won it anyway.

    My point is they cheated and got punished so we can't hold that on Mancini and say your wins were tainted.

    He didn't benefit from cheating like they did and on a fair league he destroyed them and won.

    And yh I'm a huge Mancini fan

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  4. #723
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    Even many Milan fans are of the opinion that Ancelotti was underwhelming in Italy. In 11 years of managing in Serie A, he's only won one scudetto.

    I'd agree that for a manager of his repute, he's under delivered domestically.

    He won the league with PSG and Bayern. Both teams are obviously undisputed top dog of their league, with vastly superior spending power to their nearest rival. He came close but lost out to Atletico and failed to break Barca's domestic dominance during his two years at Madrid.

    With the exception of the 2009/10 EPL title he won with Chelsea, his league titles since 2003/04 have come relatively unchallenged.

    In Europe, there's no question who has done better.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Universe View Post
    Even many Milan fans are of the opinion that Ancelotti was underwhelming in Italy. In 11 years of managing in Serie A, he's only won one scudetto.

    I'd agree that for a manager of his repute, he's under delivered domestically.

    He won the league with PSG and Bayern. Both teams are obviously undisputed top dog of their league, with vastly superior spending power to their nearest rival. He came close but lost out to Atletico and failed to break Barca's domestic dominance during his two years at Madrid.

    With the exception of the 2009/10 EPL title he won with Chelsea, his league titles since 2003/04 have come relatively unchallenged.

    In Europe, there's no question who has done better.

    He also took over PSG when they were in first place and failed to win the league with them in that season.
    Quote Originally Posted by brehme1989 View Post
    This season is unfortunately a 5 season setback. We were 1.5 mercato away from becoming a top team, now won't really have expectations of winning an important trophy until 2025.

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  7. #725
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    And conte won with cheat scum juve in an all-time low serie A. Does that count? Conte delivered an EPL (tinkerman says hi) then flopped in 2nd season "when he got his way"..
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    I swear to god Inters squad goes from Nikolai Tesla and Einstein ( Skrino&DeVrij) to Adam Sandler and Jim Carrey the more you go up higher.

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    In approximately the past fifteen seasons of top-flight Italian football, four managers have won at least one Scudetto. According to this forum, 3 of them are mediocre


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    Quote Originally Posted by vitomins View Post
    Ya, if Mancini won his without all the stuff that happened off the field, then I would say he was better too. Unfortunately there will always be a big fat * next to his Serie A wins, so no I do not think he is better than Ancelotti.
    In that case, shouldn't there be a bigger fatter * next to Conte's scudetti, both Inter and Milan had self destructed leaving no competition for Conte's Juve. At least in Mancini's case, Milan were still quite strong (CL champions etc).

    All this * business are just excuses. Usually loser's excuses, except in case of some apologetic Inter fans who like to demean their own club's accomplishments. If you were saying that Lippi's scudetti have a big fat * next to them, I can understand - they were won under very dubious circumstances with a whole lot of shit going around in the background by Moggi. But Mancini's scudetti? Those were as brilliant as any, perhaps even more of an accomplishment then Mourinho's scudetti as they broke a very long negative cycle.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluenine View Post
    In that case, shouldn't there be a bigger fatter * next to Conte's scudetti, both Inter and Milan had self destructed leaving no competition for Conte's Juve. At least in Mancini's case, Milan were still quite strong (CL champions etc).

    All this * business are just excuses. Usually loser's excuses, except in case of some apologetic Inter fans who like to demean their own club's accomplishments. IMO Mancini's scudetti were as brilliant as any, perhaps even more of an accomplishment then Mourinho's scudetti as they broke a very long negative cycle.

    I fail to see how two clubs performing badly in the league is the same as two clubs being completely removed from the league....
    Quote Originally Posted by brehme1989 View Post
    This season is unfortunately a 5 season setback. We were 1.5 mercato away from becoming a top team, now won't really have expectations of winning an important trophy until 2025.

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    Quote Originally Posted by vitomins View Post
    I fail to see how two clubs performing badly in the league is the same as two clubs being completely removed from the league....
    Two clubs removed? As far as I remember, only Juve were "removed" from the league. Milan went on to win the CL.

    Anyways, the point I was making is that Mancini's Inter won the Scudetti against tougher opposition than Conte's Juve. So why would you think of accomplishment of Mancini's Inter any less than Conte's Juve?

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    I don't understand why do we have to suffer for those 2 clubs mistakes anyway? It is not like inter encouraged them to cheat. So why do we have to look at those titles differently?

    It's either they cheated or they didn't. If they did then all that means is we would've won before 2006. Therefore Mancini and his team were the deserving champions.

    If they didn't cheat then we might aswell give back the 05/06 title back and probably every other title after that.

    I'm with the first argument which have been proven. So which argument represents you?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluenine View Post
    Two clubs removed? As far as I remember, only Juve were "removed" from the league. Milan went on to win the CL.
    Sorry, they started -8. Still not the same as a team that starts on level ground and just sucks lol.
    Quote Originally Posted by brehme1989 View Post
    This season is unfortunately a 5 season setback. We were 1.5 mercato away from becoming a top team, now won't really have expectations of winning an important trophy until 2025.

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    Quote Originally Posted by vitomins View Post
    Sorry, they started -8. Still not the same as a team that starts on level ground and just sucks lol.
    Fact remains that Conte's scudetti were easier to win than Mancini's scudetti. I don't know how much of a Inter fan you were those days or how old you were, but I can tell you that all Milan fans I knew then were laughing at that -8 penalty saying stuff like Milan will still finish 10 points ahead of Inter. Those days were like that. It was -8 for a team which won the CL that season, and finished 36 points behind Inter in Serie A.

    Those Scudetti were a huge accomplishment for Inter. As much as any scudetti for any team. Never demean that, dude.

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    Impressive guys. You are all showing real creativity at undermining and watering down all the accomplishments of Mancini, Conte and Ancelotti. I've now realized that they are all absolute bollocks. And always have been too.

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    My god not Mancini fanboy club again.

    I am avoiding this, we have been over this.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluenine View Post
    Fact remains that Conte's scudetti were easier to win than Mancini's scudetti. I don't know how much of a Inter fan you were those days or how old you were, but I can tell you that all Milan fans I knew then were laughing at that -8 penalty saying stuff like Milan will still finish 10 points ahead of Inter. Those days were like that. It was -8 for a team which won the CL that season, and finished 36 points behind Inter in Serie A.

    Those Scudetti were a huge accomplishment for Inter. As much as any scudetti for any team. Never demean that, dude.
    Probably I am alone or one of very few who believe that without any of calciopoli or other shit, we would have been on the third place. I remember very well those years. Milan and Juventus were better. Just superior. It doesn't matter how much I love Inter, but really I cannot say we would have won! Because i don't believe that!
    After 2007 Berlusconi started to dismantle his team. First wih Schevchenko and the defense, next year Kaka. They weren't a competitor anymore.

  22. #736
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    Quote Originally Posted by andrei View Post
    Probably I am alone or one of very few who believe that without any of calciopoli or other shit, we would have been on the third place. I remember very well those years. Milan and Juventus were better. Just superior. It doesn't matter how much I love Inter, but really I cannot say we would have won! Because i don't believe that!
    After 2007 Berlusconi started to dismantle his team. First wih Schevchenko and the defense, next year Kaka. They weren't a competitor anymore.
    From what alternative universe u from then? If it wouldn't happen... It happened... End off... Who the fuck cares how good cheaters were...

    If so good they were? Why cheat? :YodaVoice:

    And no u not alone

    There are a lot of masochistic around here keeping u company

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluenine View Post
    Fact remains that Conte's scudetti were easier to win than Mancini's scudetti. I don't know how much of a Inter fan you were those days or how old you were, but I can tell you that all Milan fans I knew then were laughing at that -8 penalty saying stuff like Milan will still finish 10 points ahead of Inter. Those days were like that. It was -8 for a team which won the CL that season, and finished 36 points behind Inter in Serie A.

    Those Scudetti were a huge accomplishment for Inter. As much as any scudetti for any team. Never demean that, dude.

    Sorry, I completely disagree. And I am probably around the same age as you, so I remember everything fine.
    Quote Originally Posted by brehme1989 View Post
    This season is unfortunately a 5 season setback. We were 1.5 mercato away from becoming a top team, now won't really have expectations of winning an important trophy until 2025.

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    I am pretty sure everyone was a bigger fan back then than recent years.

    It shoots straight up over the roof every time we do some coach change and everyone comes back for a while and the enthusiasm dies down along with the team’s honeymoon period. And then we have to go to the police with a list of missing people.

    Same shit, rinse and repeat since 2010.

    I am not saying this is an absolute for everyone, but at least this is the general degree of fandom I witnessed on this forum since 2005.
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  27. #739
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    Quote Originally Posted by vitomins View Post
    Ya, if Mancini won his without all the stuff that happened off the field, then I would say he was better too. Unfortunately there will always be a big fat * next to his Serie A wins, so no I do not think he is better than Ancelotti.
    And there is no asterisk for Conte's league wins, ok...

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by ADRossi View Post
    In approximately the past fifteen seasons of top-flight Italian football, four managers have won at least one Scudetto. According to this forum, 3 of them are mediocre
    Yes and maybe that should be an indication for everyone who thinks otherwise that you don't need a great coach to win in Serie A but mostly a club that does the Italian things right. And that usually means following all the wrongdoings. The manager is usually just for decoration. It's been like this for decades, it's not something new. Owners have the power and the say and it's all down to the fucked up system's appetite.

    The only one of the "mediocres" that has showed something in Europe is Allegri. And as much as he's nowhere near being elite, he's far better than both Mancini and Conte.
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    No, there are no bloody asterisks besides Conte's Scudettos. Would like to remind you that the last two seasons before Conte arrived Juve was 7th in league. First under Ferrara and Zaccheroni and then under Delneri.

    In 2011-2012 Juventus was completely transformed, losing zero games in league. If this season is not an impressive achievement for a coach, I don't know what is.
    Last edited by Johnny Ludlow; 13 Jul 19 at 09:33.


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