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Thread: Italian Serie A 2019/2020

  1. #81
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    That is what happens when you're stuck in history.
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  3. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by vitomins View Post
    Exactly. Brehme has a bad habit of only highlighting the stuff that supports his opinion. He will highlight a bad 15-game stint at Atalanta to "prove" Conte is not a good manager.

    Marino was terrible at Atalanta. He also became President of Avellino after they were sent down to Serie B and made them even worse. His last season there they finished 15th in Serie B. It was their worst season in 16 years and they only missed out on relegation because of their goal differential.

    You mention Dunga at Pescara, but what about all his other failed transfers that season? He was fired because he signed all of these unproven foreign players and they all sucked and Pescara went straight back down to Serie B. Not sure how you can compare it to bringing in Casemiro wither. Dunga was almost 30 years old at the time and played for Pisa and Fiorentina already, so he was already in Italy. 2 years later he was playing in Japan lol.
    Your Avellino story sounds like a nice response, too bad it's a very inaccurate one. He took over Avellino when they fell to Serie B, not being able to even register a team and despite all that, he manages to take this bankrupt club 3 points away from promotion... It was a do or bust season and they almost went bust. Next season they still managed to not be part of a list of defunct clubs by finishing midtable. Pierpaolo Marino being a perfectionist miracle worker was not pleased by this direction and left the club. The following year they finished last.

    Let's also forget that this is the guy who resurrected Roma (even briefly) taking them from midtable finishes to Scudetto contention (3rd place). He could have gone anywhere he wanted but he decided to go save Avellino. It's nice to call "failure" without seeing the context, but his Avellino adventure was considered by everyone in the world of Calcio as a miracle. That team wasn't even supposed to exist but he almost took them back to Serie A. It was do or bust though as he himself had told the new owner, so they couldn't really achieve that the following years. This was a bankrupt Serie B club from a small town in south Italy in the late 80s. Please tell me what the likelihood of achieving anything with them was. Teams from the south that came up back then were like fireworks. Come up in a crazy fashion, stay in Serie A for 1 or 2 seasons, then be doomed in a Lega Pro/Serie B elevator challenge...

    It's very easy to see something on paper and assume it was a failure. In fact, Avellino even playing in Serie B when Marino took over was itself phenomenal. Staying in it for 3-4 seasons was an even bigger feat.

    As for Dunga, he was Brazil's captain, that's the significance of it. It was a major coup for freaking Pescara to sign the captain of the best national team in the world (even if he was a 'hated' one in Brazil) even if he already was playing in Italy. Maybe quality wise and situation wise the Casemiro example isn't remotely close, but in terms of Brazilian football it kinda is. Even naming Casemiro as a counter example falls short. It's not like Dunga didn't have other offers from European clubs.

    As for failing at Atalanta. This was yet another doomed club. A point deduction in his first season and a predicted 20th finish, yet they managed to stay up. You're comparing him with current Atalanta, ignoring that without him it wouldn't even be there. It's unfair and naive to do this comparison. You have to compare this to other teams in that situation. Lecce, Siena, Bari, Cesena, Novara, Palermo, Verona...
    And if you want a more recent example, look no further than this season's Chievo Verona who also had the advantage of already being a Serie A club the previous seasons. Anyone thought that Chievo would stay up? Quite doubtful. Well, Pierpaolo Marino achieved just that with Atalanta, despite having point deductions in his first two seasons and turned the club around with a change of mentalit. There's no instant win button, it takes years.

    This is the guy who brought them Papu Gomez (and Maxi Moralez before, who was like 50% of the reason they stayed up), managed to keep them in Serie A despite initial financial trouble and point deductions, got them talents such as Kessie and de Roon which they sold for significant amounts and also promoted players like Sportiello, Caldara, Conti, Gabbiadini and several others, whilst his work with the academy also provided players such as Gagliardini who was sold for a shitload of money. I think he left Atalanta because he wasn't allowed to pick the new manager and they stuck with Reja. I heard he wanted to go with Massimo Carrera who he'd have to convince to not be part of the Italian national team of course, but knowing Marino it'd be feasible.

    P.S: If you think a points deduction makes no difference, just look at Milan in 2006-7. They won the Champions League but felt inferior in Italy because of a -8 and barely got 69 points on the field, the same amount as we had this season...

    P.S2: Never leave context out of this. Pierpaolo Marino was a perfectionist who had a hands on approach. Italian football even to this day to a large extent is run by the club's owners/presidents. Marino could not work for Moratti, Berlusconi, Cragnotti or others who felt that football was their toy and team building was part of their role as owners. Which explains why only a few mid-tier clubs have had great sporting directors. There is a very recent swing to this notion that a club has to have a director of football, a sporting director, a "sports CEO" and all that. It's not even a decade long that this has been considered a necessity for clubs.
    Last edited by brehme1989; 15 Jun 19 at 12:00.
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    I'm just curious if anyone else completely glosses over the Serie A history lesson posts


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    Quote Originally Posted by ADRossi View Post
    I'm just curious if anyone else completely glosses over the Serie A history lesson posts
    I quite like them, but with just a bit of a grain of salt because there's slant in them (which isn't an insult; we all have slants towards how we interpret history; it's why it's stressed in academics to use multiple sources to get the most objective lens on a given topic, because any individual source will likely have some kind of slant in them, intended or otherwise). I can't even claim to know what or who Avellino are or were so just that part alone has told me more about them than I ever knew.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ADRossi View Post
    I'm just curious if anyone else completely glosses over the Serie A history lesson posts
    On the contrary.

    Yes, he might be a little over the top, and yes he might very subjective and selective in his writing, and can sound a little arrogant and at times even supercilious in his way of arguing, but overall, since his return to the forum, I find Brehme has been a tremendous asset to the forum.

    We have plenty of posters who can provide unfunny one-liners (I'm here, if need be), but few seem to posses the knowledge he does.

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    Frosinone and Immobile involved in match-fixing scandal: the details
    15/06/2019, 18:27
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    The latest Spanish investigation into match-fixing (Operation Oikos) reveals a disturbing detail about Italy and Serie A. In fact, the newspapers El Pais and Marca both write that this afternoon, the investigation talked about a match-fixing attempt in Frosinone, as well as about Ciro Immobile, though not initially for match-fixing reasons.

    The main suspects, Mattia Mariotti and Carlos Abanda, are referred to as the links between the match-fixing organisation and the football world. In an incident which was brought up, Mariotti was in contact with a third person to try and soften the position of three-four Frosinone players, thus fixing a game.

    Among the evidence, there are recordings from when the two are travelling in a taxi in Rome, discussing what the outcome of the Frosinone meeting should be, and how the match should be fixed.
    It's still unknown if the proposal was rejected or not, but in Italy, not reporting such an attempt can have you banned for multiple years.

    With regards to Immobile, Mariotti has reportedly told Abanda that the striker regularly places normal football bets, though it's unclear what his intention behind this is. As a professional player, of course, it raises suspicions.

  9. #87
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    It is not correct that not reporting an attempt at match fixing will get you banned for "years" (if you know about it but are not directly involved in the cheating, it's usually just months). It is however true that an attempt at fixing a match, even if you don't succeed, will get you (in theory) a ban of a couple of years.
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    He is 29 and if he is banned for 2 years, his career is practically ruined.

  12. #89
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    Juve announced Sarri
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    So Guardiola is officially at Juve. Momblano was right all along.
    “Is shitting on any moment of decency part of your job description?”

    At Inter. With Inter.
    To Europa League.

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    Have a look at the comments they're not thrilled. The dogs thought they'd get Guardiola.
    https://twitter.com/juventusfc/statu...43316803559427
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    Can't get more delusional people than hunchback fans. I wonder what will Momblano do,probably try jumping off a cliff.
    “Is shitting on any moment of decency part of your job description?”

    At Inter. With Inter.
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  17. #93
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    Who's Momblano ?
    INTERISTA 4 EVER

    “I don’t think the formation model counts, it’s all about the principles and the attitude" - Stefano Pioli

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  19. #94

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    Oh, just read Juventuz.com forum end of May discussions on who will be their next manager, it's comedy gold. Momblano is a Juventus insider and journo whom juventini adore. Idiots at juventuz.com forum were gullible enough to believe his tweets on Guardiola as he was daily tweeting that Sarri story is a decoy and fake as Juve had Guardiola from May all along but couldn't announce it cause of UEFA investigation on City.

    Even when Di Marzio et al. said that Sarri is heading to Juve he was the only one insisting that this is bullshit.

    He amassed a lot of followers and got a lot of publicity so probably he still benefited from that.
    “Is shitting on any moment of decency part of your job description?”

    At Inter. With Inter.
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  21. #95
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    There was basically no calciomercato and a lot of agiotage instead, behind “Guardiola to Juventus” (they can deny and build all the narratives they want), but only one thing is sure: from distance, the aggressive cult following formed by Juventus fans around journalists like Momblano and the plethora of self-proclaimed insiders claiming “done deal with Pep, just wait and see” has been creepy and borderline psychotic. Unprecedented.

    Di Marzio will keep it classy, while I hear Pedullà is already taking his brutal revenge and providing popcorn.
    I agree, most of them are happy for the publicity, in victory or defeat, at the end of the saga: including Momblano, who had a "capital of trust" to spend (he was among the first to push the "Ronaldo to Juventus" rumour last summer) and recently started a collaboration with SportMediaset regarding Juventus - taaac.

    Now, Gobbi can properly moan and protest for all their reasons (and we need it, because if Sarri “clicks” with Juventus, we should worry).

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  23. #96
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  25. #97
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    No way I'm the only one who thinks Sarri is yet to be considered among the top coaches in the world. Or rather, even though this move has been expected for weeks, I'm a bit puzzled by it. To me, the profiles of the coach and club do not match. Being as 'objective' as I can, Sarri just doesn't seem "good enough" for juve's current and future profile. If I'm not mistaken, the only trophy Sarri has won in his life is the Europa League a few weeks ago. Admittedly, Conte and Allegri were not huge names before they went to juve either. But I think juve back then were at a different point.

    To me, it seems like juve are currently on a mission to set themselves up as one of the absolute 'elite of the elite' so to speak. They've dominated domestically for so long but they've been aiming for bigger and bigger, obviously gunning for the CL. The Cristiano transfer was also a massive move, not just in footballing terms but in terms of raising juve's profile to fit this 'elite of the elite' profile that I think they're trying to achieve.

    My point is, I personally don't think Sarri fits into that profile at all. Guardiola does, definitely. As would Zidane considering his unprecedented consecutive 3 CL's. But Sarri? I'm either underrating him or it's a big gamble for juve.
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    Quote Originally Posted by alvaro View Post
    lol

    This is what I like about Sarri. He dgaff
    INTERISTA 4 EVER

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  28. #99
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    The only bad thing about Sarri to Juve is that Martusciello will be a member of his staff. He had done wonders with our defence. I can't help but laugh with gobbi claiming Agnelli's decision to fire Allegri was similar to Moratti's decision to replace Mancini with Mourinho in quest of CL trophy.
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  30. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by I4E View Post
    Juve announced Sarri
    goodbye fuckardi
    Nel bene e nel male, forza Internazionale!!

    #IcardiOut

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