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Thread: Alexis Sanchez

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    sanchez has a conract that guarantees him £25million after tax in the nextt 2 years. he aint walking away from that unless he gets a good settlement.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by monster09 View Post
    Don't think that clause is valid for European games, maybe some sort of gentleman agreement.

    I think it's more to do with saving player from injuries as we want to sell him and also to put pressure on Inter to sign him. ManUtd have nothing to gain by allowing him to play in Europa league games.

    - - - Updated - - -

    He looks very much settled at Inter and better than Martinez in few games, it's in best interest of both clubs to conclude this signing. Inter can sign a player without worrying about how the player will settle and also they know how good or bad he is in this system, whereas ManUtd can be happy that they can offload high earner who isn't part of their future plans.
    we'd pay him at most half of what he earns now, and even for that i'd argue the value for money since his career will be over in 2-4 years anyway. Our 3rd highest earner being a backup striker doesnt make any sense for anyone.

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    Quote Originally Posted by .h. View Post
    we'd pay him at most half of what he earns now, and even for that i'd argue the value for money since his career will be over in 2-4 years anyway. Our 3rd highest earner being a backup striker doesnt make any sense for anyone.
    If it's a free transfer he might end up getting that in good wages and signing on fee. Obviously he might have to give up at least few million if he wants to play regularly. Also I don't think he will be a back up striker if he keeps his form.

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  4. #443
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    Quote Originally Posted by monster09 View Post
    If it's a free transfer he might end up getting that in good wages and signing on fee. Obviously he might have to give up at least few million if he wants to play regularly. Also I don't think he will be a back up striker if he keeps his form.
    Inter arent paying £50m over 3 years for Sanchez. Even over 4 years looks pricey, if you think thats 7mil euros a year after tax - that'd make him comparable to Lukaku in earnings. He's done nothing to demonstrate that level.

    Benchmarked against our squad, I'd say he's a 3-4mil euros net a year player. Free might move that up a little bit like Godin, but maybe 5 mil euros.

    I suspect the only way he's coming here is if he takes a massive pay cut for some reason, or United buy him out (partially) and terminate his contract early. I could see a buy out for, say, £15mil, but that means United take a book loss of £25mil because of his residual transfer value too.

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    Quote Originally Posted by .h. View Post
    Inter arent paying £50m over 3 years for Sanchez. Even over 4 years looks pricey, if you think thats 7mil euros a year after tax - that'd make him comparable to Lukaku in earnings. He's done nothing to demonstrate that level.

    Benchmarked against our squad, I'd say he's a 3-4mil euros net a year player. Free might move that up a little bit like Godin, but maybe 5 mil euros.

    I suspect the only way he's coming here is if he takes a massive pay cut for some reason, or United buy him out (partially) and terminate his contract early. I could see a buy out for, say, £15mil, but that means United take a book loss of £25mil because of his residual transfer value too.
    Didn't they change tax for high earners which helped Serie A clubs, that they will be taxed only for 50% of their wages.

    I don't see him getting a golden handshake, maybe he will end up going out on loan till he runs his contract down. If he plays well then hopefully he can be a backup CF for us.

    I think he will sign for a low transfer fee or 0, which means he will end up getting good contract. I can't see him being a free agent and earning just 3-4 million anywhere. Like he has showed at Inter, he is still good enough player for most teams.

    In any case I hope this will be settled this season. We should loan him if there is obligation to buy, else just keep him in the squad and use him as back up for CF position.

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    yeah its a good point about the taxation. It does make it a bit easier - though its conditional on the player being there for 2 years. I suspect Sanchez being here for the first year already contributes though maybe?

    If/when we sell Godin it'll be interesting to see what happens from a tax perspective - I suspect we'll have to pay back taxes.

    Sanchez has played well in a few games, but his effort and availability this year simply doesnt warrant, in this squad, anything higher than like 4 mil a year.

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    I'm almost certain there will be a golden handshake, in one way or another. United still saves the money and Alexis leaves some money on the table to be able to play football.

    There is tax reduction for people coming from abroad to Italy. That will not unfortunately apply to Alexis anymore since he's already in Italy. Unless they can somehow argument that the current contract will continue, since now Alexis taxes are reduced of course. Anyway like browha said we will MAYBE pay max 5-6m€ net to have him, so there's still a lot of money between those figures and his current net salary. If the reduction applies, I don't know if we can or want to go higher.

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    i cant remember how long with reduction is valid for, but maybe like 3 years? if its a longer term signing, you'd use the reduction to save yourself cost, rather than pay the player more - because you'd open yourself up to increased costs after the 3 years anyway. If its someone like Godin or Sanchez on a 2/3 year deal its fine


    I suspect.

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    Quote Originally Posted by .h. View Post
    sanchez has a conract that guarantees him £25million after tax in the nextt 2 years. he aint walking away from that unless he gets a good settlement.

    - - - Updated - - -



    we'd pay him at most half of what he earns now, and even for that i'd argue the value for money since his career will be over in 2-4 years anyway. Our 3rd highest earner being a backup striker doesnt make any sense for anyone.
    Holy shit, is he really earning that much money? I thought he was on 10-15m.

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    we need this man for the whole EL if we want to win this trophy
    Nel bene e nel male, forza Internazionale!!

    #IcardiOut

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  14. #450
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    Quote Originally Posted by CafeCordoba View Post
    I'm almost certain there will be a golden handshake, in one way or another. United still saves the money and Alexis leaves some money on the table to be able to play football.

    There is tax reduction for people coming from abroad to Italy. That will not unfortunately apply to Alexis anymore since he's already in Italy. Unless they can somehow argument that the current contract will continue, since now Alexis taxes are reduced of course. Anyway like browha said we will MAYBE pay max 5-6m€ net to have him, so there's still a lot of money between those figures and his current net salary. If the reduction applies, I don't know if we can or want to go higher.
    I think Golden shandshake will be in the form of exempting transfer fee, which means he can get good signing on fee from his future club. IIRC Can got around 15 million as signing on fee, free agents or players with very low transfer fee will always get good wages and signing on fee.

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    Quote Originally Posted by qb4ever_2k View Post
    Holy shit, is he really earning that much money? I thought he was on 10-15m.
    as I understand it 500k a week GBP before tax.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by monster09 View Post
    I think Golden shandshake will be in the form of exempting transfer fee, which means he can get good signing on fee from his future club. IIRC Can got around 15 million as signing on fee, free agents or players with very low transfer fee will always get good wages and signing on fee.
    generally yes that is right but I wouldn't want Inter to spend 15mil fee + maybe 10m over 2 years for this guy.

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    browha, yeah actually Sanchez isn't getting the tax reduction this year because he's here only on loan (for one year).

    I found these restrictions for the Growth Decree to be applied:

    The rule provides specific tax benefits for professional sportsmen and sportswomen encouraged to transfer their tax residence in our country starting from the tax period starting on January 1, 2020.
    The constraints for taking advantage of the new tax regime have been lightened and in particular for the world of football are:

    • having been resident abroad for at least 2 tax periods prior to moving to Italy;
    • the obligation to stay in Italy for at least two years following the transfer of residence;
    • the performance of the work activity mainly in the Italian territory.
    https://www.akeron.com/en/decree-on-...d-of-football/

    I'm reading from this that we couldn't use that to Lukaku nor Godin because they signed in summer, so they hadn't been residents abroad for at least 2 tax periods prior moving to Italy. And same goes for Conte then? Or is it that the tax period is a whole year and since they were here only for 6 months, full tax period wasn't finished so the reduction is valid for them all?

    Anyway, for Sanchez it definitely is not because of the 1 year loan deal, as the decree requires 2 year residence. If we continue the loan/we purchase, it can somehow be applied to Sanchez too?

    monster09, about the golden handshake. I think it might be something in between. United owns Sanchez 24-25m€ net (costs over 45m€ to the club) for the following 2 years. If they pay like 1/3 of that as golden handshake now to the player (so maybe like 15-16m€ cost to the club, as we talk about gross here), then he can accept considerably lower salary at Inter. If we give him 3-year contract and 5m€ net salary, it will come close to that 24-25m€.

    United saves 2/3 of wages paid (gross 30m€), but loses the book value of the player. So they demand some transfer fee from Inter. It has to be really modest fee, because Inter is investing heavily to the player in the form of salary already and his age makes it hard to keep amortizing the transfer fee further and further with extensions. Other option is selling the player but that's even harder given the age and the salary.

    To me, it seems like a very interesting negotiations since both clubs have incentives to get it done. The player has an incentive to get it done. Clubs can try to persuade the player to take some financial hit to get playing time in an already familiar environment where he fits in. Very delicious situation!

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    Quote Originally Posted by CafeCordoba View Post
    browha, yeah actually Sanchez isn't getting the tax reduction this year because he's here only on loan (for one year).

    I found these restrictions for the Growth Decree to be applied:


    https://www.akeron.com/en/decree-on-...d-of-football/

    I'm reading from this that we couldn't use that to Lukaku nor Godin because they signed in summer, so they hadn't been residents abroad for at least 2 tax periods prior moving to Italy. And same goes for Conte then? Or is it that the tax period is a whole year and since they were here only for 6 months, full tax period wasn't finished so the reduction is valid for them all?
    Yeah - the restriction on two years post transfer would prevent us using that on Sanchez right now. It may, infact, fuck us for Sanchez for next year as well, because he will have completed at least one period of being in Italy.

    I think you're right, I would read that rule as meaning we dont get tax relief on Lukaku or Conte. It does say, though:

    In a few days will start the winter market of Italian football for the 2019/2020 season. Already during the summer window of summer 2019 there were contracts for the purchase of new professional footballers (but also Technicians) from abroad that included the application of the last Growth Decree, in particular the D. L 34/2019 of 30 April this year.


    RE your question on tax residency, I'm not clear what you mean? It says they have to be tax residents abroad before moving to Italy for 2 years - Lukaku, Conte and Godin all tick that box. Lukaku has been UK tax resident since 2011, Godin in spain since 2007.

    It's unclear to me where Conte has been resident - clearly England while he was at Chelsea, which started July 2016 (though perhaps a bit earlier), and he was dismissed July 2018 - in principle he would have been tax resident for two UK tax years, but if he moved back to Italy in July 18 when he was sacked (which seems likely, but would want confirmation) then he'd be ineligible.

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    Found this also:
    https://mse.dlapiper.com/post/102flb...x-incentives-f

    For instance, individuals who are enrolled in the Italian register as from 4 July 2019 are considered to be Italian tax resident starting from 2020 and, therefore, can benefit from the new tax incentives as from tax period 2020;
    From that I'd that Conte and Godin are not applicable to the reduction while Lukaku is. How is it that the club couldn't wait for few days with Godin? Conte signed already in May so that was far before the 4th of July.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CafeCordoba View Post
    Found this also:
    https://mse.dlapiper.com/post/102flb...x-incentives-f



    From that I'd that Conte and Godin are not applicable to the reduction while Lukaku is. How is it that the club couldn't wait for few days with Godin? Conte signed already in May so that was far before the 4th of July.
    signing a contract is different to payroll dates, though. In the UK the date of payroll would be the most important thing (look at the recent furlough payments as an example), so as long as you were on payroll on a certain date then you were fine. I suspect this is the same thing - i.e. anyone who was on payroll in June didnt count, but July does.


    I note the 4th of July is a thursday, I dont kn ow about Italy but in the UK you typically get paid on a Friday (or last day of the month, etc) so this might well be saying 'anyone employed in July onwards'

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    Okay, then probably they've played those in a way to get everyone applicable to the reduction.

    Anyway, now we are a bit far from Sanchez (but not that far!). Gonna be an interesting July in this regard since I don't see an agreement over EL without agreement over at least next year too. And probably it will be a transfer / 2-year loan and they fix the financial parameters accordingly.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CafeCordoba View Post
    I'm almost certain there will be a golden handshake, in one way or another. United still saves the money and Alexis leaves some money on the table to be able to play football.
    I have my doubts on whether Man Utd will pay Sanchez to leave. They have seen the performances at Inter too, they know we want him. At best we can get a free transfer. Which means Inter and Sanchez reach a compromise wage that works for both.

    Quote Originally Posted by CafeCordoba View Post
    There is tax reduction for people coming from abroad to Italy. That will not unfortunately apply to Alexis anymore since he's already in Italy. Unless they can somehow argument that the current contract will continue, since now Alexis taxes are reduced of course. Anyway like browha said we will MAYBE pay max 5-6m€ net to have him, so there's still a lot of money between those figures and his current net salary. If the reduction applies, I don't know if we can or want to go higher.
    If I'm not mistaken, the new tax rule already applies to Sanchez this year. I see no reason why it won't apply next year.

    5-6m net is not going to work with a player who is earning 20m+ net. I am sorry, but that is just not realistic. While Sanchez's current salary is too high, a player of his caliber and class will command 10m+ even in this climate. If he is available on a free, I suspect he will get that offer from some clubs. Look at Cavani, who is in a similar class level as a player, he will get 10m+ as salary as a free agent. Sanchez is 2 years young than Cavani, and should have 3 years at top level left in him, injuries permitting.

    One way to look at it is getting a player for Sanchez's class for 40m-50m total cost over 3 years. That gives Sanchez a net wage of around 12m, that is a level I see working for the player. In these cases, you have to look at total annual cost to club. If Lukaku costs us around 25m gross a year (amortisation+wages), Sanchez for 15m gross a year doesn't seem too much. If Sanchez can demonstrate over the next month that he can play like yesterday consistently, it may make sense for Inter. Coz replacing Sanchez with a player of similar quality will cost at least as much if not much, much more. This is a call Inter have to make, and hopefully make this call before the EL starts.
    Last edited by Bluenine; 02 Jul 20 at 13:33.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluenine View Post
    I have my doubts on whether Man Utd will pay Sanchez to leave. They have seen the performances at Inter too, they know we want him. At best we can get a free transfer. Which means Inter and Sanchez reach a compromise wage that works for both.



    If I'm not mistaken, the new tax rule already applies to Sanchez this year. I see no reason why it won't apply next year.

    5-6m net is not going to work with a player who is earning 20m+ net. I am sorry, but that is just not realistic. While Sanchez's current salary is too high, a player of his caliber and class will command 10m+ even in this climate. If he is available on a free, I suspect he will get that offer from some clubs. Look at Cavani, who is in a similar class level as a player, he will get 10m+ as salary as a free agent. Sanchez is 2 years young than Cavani, and should have 3 years at top level left in him, injuries permitting.

    One way to look at it is getting a player for Sanchez's class for 40m-50m total cost over 3 years. That gives Sanchez a net wage of around 12m, that is a level I see working for the player. In these cases, you have to look at total annual cost to club. If Lukaku costs us around 25m gross a year (amortisation+wages), Sanchez for 15m gross a year doesn't seem too much. If Sanchez can demonstrate over the next month that he can play like yesterday consistently, it may make sense for Inter. Coz replacing Sanchez with a player of similar quality will cost at least as much if not much, much more. This is a call Inter have to make, and hopefully make this call before the EL starts.
    re exemption for sanchez, there's no obligation for the player to stay in Italy for 2 years right now, so at face value, there's no tax benefit.


    Sanchez and Cavani is a ludicrous comparison to be honest. He's been shit since the year after Brexit, and even now he's 2 goals in 20? 21? games for Inter.

    He has potential but he's hardly guaranteed quality right now.

    Andrea Pinamonti has more top flight goals than Sanchez since 2017. Probably in less minutes too.

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    Statistics are misleading. We never perform poorly with Sanchez, he creates a lot.

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    I'm just saying. Sanchez is gonna be one of our top 3 earners no matter how you cut it. I wouldnt say he's worth it on the basis of this season so far. Do you think he adds more value to this team than Sensi, Barella, Skriniar, De Vrij, Bastoni?

    Hell, even Martinez is substantially lower salary (even on his potential new contract) than Sanchez.

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