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Thread: Racism

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    Racism

    Fifa Vows To Implement Racial Legislation

    Time and tides, they say, wait for no man. And that
    adage could well be true when the Federation of International Football (FIFA)
    starts to implement its zero policy on racism.

    Racial taunting has marred football pitches and terraces in
    the last few weeks with Ivorian Marc Zoro, Cameroonian
    Samuel Eto’o and Ghanaian Asamoah Gyan all being the latest victims.


    But the patient dog, they say, eats the fattest bone, and FIFA
    has clarified the deadline they set for the implementation of a
    new law that punishes clubs whose fans racially abuse players.


    This comes after Italian Serie A club Inter Milan escaped with a
    mere fine after some of their fans racially abused Messina's Ivorian
    Marc Zoro last week and for the second time this season.


    Under the new system, clubs found guilty of failing to prevent
    their supporters from abusing players on racial grounds could be docked
    three points for a first offence, six for a second and even relegated
    in the case of repeated incidents.


    The new legislation also underlines empty stadium as a tough stand
    on clubs for the behaviour of their racist fans.


    However, on Wednesday, Inter Milan escaped with a fine
    of just US$31,000 from the Italian football authorities as punishment for
    the racist behaviour of their fans during a Serie A match against
    Messina on Saturday, with no hint of a points deduction.


    The new ruling would come into effect immediately for those
    football associations whose regulations already contain a clause
    setting out the same punishment, FIFA said in a statement posted
    on their website.


    But other football associations that have no such rule regarding
    racial abuse, such as Italy, have been given a July 1
    deadline to implement the new law, Fifa said.


    Zoro was subjected to monkey chants at the San Siro, leading
    to speculation that Inter may be the first club to fall foul of FIFA'S
    tough new laws.


    A points deduction would have hit Inter Milan's
    Champions League qualification hopes but observers around Europe
    were stunned to
    see the Italian giants let off with just a fine.


    Racism has been condemned in the strongest terms possible by
    human rights groups, political and religious leaders around the world.


    Pope Benedict XVI was the latest high profile figure to condemn
    racism during a pre-match ceremony where Italy thrashed Germany 4-1.




    -----------------------------------------------

    I feel we should have a Thread for this..
    You are free to delete or move it.

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  2. #2
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    eh, i think its stupid to punish the clubs.

    As if there proud of it, i personally think they'll never squash racism out of the game.


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    Quote Originally Posted by helal25
    eh, i think its stupid to punish the clubs.

    As if there proud of it, i personally think they'll never squash racism out of the game.
    Yes it stupid to punish the clubs.. but they feel that its the clubs that have to do something to stop it.
    I'm crushed, Black and Blue, but you know I'd do it all again for you.

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    they can do what they want but there will always be some idiots no matter how many millions a clubs spend to stop racism.


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    So group of Inter fans should come to bbilan home match in red&black T-shirts, they should insult black players from opposite team and bbilan will be punished???

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    Quote Originally Posted by majkiZV
    So group of Inter fans should come to bbilan home match in red&black T-shirts, they should insult black players from opposite team and bbilan will be punished???
    Lol... good idea. I dont think it would happen..
    I'm crushed, Black and Blue, but you know I'd do it all again for you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by KoSoVa
    Lol... good idea. I dont think it would happen..
    It is just an example. There should be any fans in Europe who would do that...

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    24 10 years of FIF
    Quote Originally Posted by helal25
    eh, i think its stupid to punish the clubs.

    As if there proud of it, i personally think they'll never squash racism out of the game.
    Welll they almost have to punish the club coz there the only one who can do somthing against it ¨
    only problem it that the club also is unable to bring out all the racism out of the stadium
    Which matches do you feel more, those with Juventus or Milan?
    "With Milan, without doubt. And I don't like the Rossoneri fans either because they have a way of behaving, particularly when they win, that I don't appreciate."
    Javier Zanetti

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adriano@10
    Welll they almost have to punish the club coz there the only one who can do somthing against it ¨
    only problem it that the club also is unable to bring out all the racism out of the stadium
    Fabio mate. i dont get you.

    Lets say Moratti spent millions on campaigns, banning certain members, hiring more security. Me and you could turn up one day with a banner or certain things to say and not give a flyin $^%# about the consequence.

    When someone is racist, the amount of th ings u say or do in this world wont change it. Theres no way clubs can tackle the problem and stamp it out.


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    24 10 years of FIF
    Quote Originally Posted by helal25
    Fabio mate. i dont get you.

    Lets say Moratti spent millions on campaigns, banning certain members, hiring more security. Me and you could turn up one day with a banner or certain things to say and not give a flyin $^%# about the consequence.

    When someone is racist, the amount of th ings u say or do in this world wont change it. Theres no way clubs can tackle the problem and stamp it out.
    Yeah i agree on this, i sad ther will always be some racist !!!!
    but the only one who can somhow ban ppl out of the stadium and realy controlle who goes in the stadium is the club! and not the Fifa ore UEFA
    so i understand why the punish the club!!¨
    i mean look at clubs like Lazio it s obvious that they wint dooing much to keep racism out of the stadium!!
    Which matches do you feel more, those with Juventus or Milan?
    "With Milan, without doubt. And I don't like the Rossoneri fans either because they have a way of behaving, particularly when they win, that I don't appreciate."
    Javier Zanetti

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    Lazio is a bad example since there was no example of racial abuse in the past couple of seasons since the incident with Liverani.

    Plus the article shows the stupidity of the writer -or the whole media- who love to stir sh*t around. There were no monkey chants, the moron who wrote this knows nothing about what happened.

    I agree that club should not be punished, I'd make strict rules about banning fans, I F:
    They can be pin-pointed
    There's enough evidence.

    If the italian court wouldn't have just given a f*ck about these 2 points due to the media-hype about racism, nothing would've happened last week. There was no clear evidence last year, yet they banned the fans.

    I wonder though that why doesn't the media hype about Kameni getting abused by his OWN fans, there's proof, they were pinpointed yet nothing happened. It's only us...
    100% record when attending games, Moratti, please hire me!

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    Quote Originally Posted by helal25
    Fabio mate. i dont get you.

    Lets say Moratti spent millions on campaigns, banning certain members, hiring more security. Me and you could turn up one day with a banner or certain things to say and not give a flyin $^%# about the consequence.

    When someone is racist, the amount of th ings u say or do in this world wont change it. Theres no way clubs can tackle the problem and stamp it out.
    helal i have read your posts above and you know what mate you sound like you don't want it to stop, but thats only my opinion.

    anyway it is true that it's difficult to change people's attitudes towards anything, it's also socially acceptable in some countries to racially taunt someone, in the UK people usually frown upon racism and tend to look at it as the past rather than the present but this isn't the same in all countries, also no one should tell a person to change their attitudes the person should change it themselves.
    Last edited by Durai; 09 Apr 06 at 17:14.

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    Solution is easy. Install CCTV and catch those who do it, and give them a year ban first time, and a permanent one the next time.

    Zamat, Lazio had more incidents. Just in the beginning of the season, they did it to Zoro. And this can't be denied, since many people heared it. He almost jumped and fought the fans I think and Lotito had to apologize at the end.

    And if I am not mistaken, Lazio fans did similar things in the UEFA cup a season or two ago. Simply, some of their fans should get a permanet ban from all football stadia, enough is enough.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hamed
    Solution is easy. Install CCTV and catch those who do it, and give them a year ban first time, and a permanent one the next time.

    Zamat, Lazio had more incidents. Just in the beginning of the season, they did it to Zoro. And this can't be denied, since many people heared it. He almost jumped and fought the fans I think and Lotito had to apologize at the end.

    And if I am not mistaken, Lazio fans did similar things in the UEFA cup a season or two ago. Simply, some of their fans should get a permanet ban from all football stadia, enough is enough.
    yes CCTV has proven very successful in the premiership but the Italian FA are very slow on matters like this and will blame bureacracy for this about paperwork and other things. but CCTV is a very good idea.

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    If removing racism means removing all of the supporters who are the ones that are there every game that put up the coreos and start the chants then don't do anything about it. Racism is everywhere not only in football and those who are affected by racist chants should quit.

    There I said it.

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    Interesting letter from a Rangers fan,

    Gianni Infantino
    Legal Services Division
    UEFA
    Route de Geneve 46
    Case Postale
    CH-1260
    Nyon 2
    SWITZERLAND

    Dear Sir,
    I am writing to you today in connection with reports that UEFA are to
    investigate allegations of racist and discriminatory chanting by supporters
    of Rangers FC at matches in the Champions League against Villareal. As a
    Rangers supporter myself I find it deeply worrying that UEFA are choosing
    to pick on Rangers supporters, while ignoring discriminatory or sectarian
    and racist chanting by other clubs supporters, very often directed at
    Rangers and their mainly Scottish Protestant support. Ultimately, you
    either believe in freedom of speech or you don't. UEFA has made it clear
    that individuals do not have total freedom of expression within the
    confines of a football stadium. In that case, I would like to ask why UEFA
    do not take action against certain other clubs and countries supporters,
    indeed rewarding some of the worst offenders for their behaviour.

    The first example I would like to cite is that of Celtic FC. They are
    traditionally the Catholic, left-wing club in Glasgow, as opposed to
    Rangers traditional Protestant conservatism. The most commonly heard chant
    at Celtic Park is 'For It's A Grand Old Team To Play For.' This chant, sung
    by a majority at Celtic Park, includes the line "we don't care what the
    animals say, what the hell do we care?" The word 'animals' is clearly being
    used as a racially derogatory term for Protestant Rangers supporters,
    suggesting they are somehow sub-human or racially inferior. Almost every
    other chant sung by the Celtic supporters refers to the IRA, an Irish
    terrorist organisation responsible for the murder of hundreds of British
    civilians and soldiers, and their 'struggle' for a united Ireland. Chants
    include "ooh-ah up the 'RA," "IRA all the way" to the tune of Rod Stewart's
    'We Are Sailing,' "They gave us James McGrory and Paul McStay and the IRA,"
    and "the Boys of the old brigade." These chants are particularly prevalent
    amongst the clubs travelling support. At home they are more likely to chant
    "go home British soldiers go home, have you got no homes of your own," and
    the Soldiers Song, which is the national anthem of the Irish Republic, but
    what soldiers have to do with a game of football is unclear. Celtic FC also
    have a history of racial abuse against black players, going back to 1988
    when Mark Walters was signed by Rangers, becoming the first black player in
    Scotland's Premier Division. When he played his first match at Celtic Park,
    he was pelted with bananas and subjected to monkey chants by the home
    supporters. No action was ever taken against Celtic FC for the behaviour of
    their supporters on this occassion. On the field, current club captain Neil
    Lennon was filmed by TV cameras aiming sectarian insults at the Rangers
    management team during a match at Rangers' Ibrox Stadium, shouting 'dirty
    Orange *Beep*' towards someone in the Rangers technical area, in
    reference to the Orange Order, being an ancient Protestant organisation. No
    action was taken against the player, the incident not having been
    highlighted by the Scottish media. At recent Celtic-Rangers matches which
    Celtic won, in November 2005, thousands of Celtic supporters taunted the
    Rangers manager with a chant of 'cheer up Alex McLeish, you sad Orange
    *Beep*.' Again no action was taken by the authorities, again the media
    having failed to highlight these chants. Hardly surprising that Celtic FC
    and their supporters act in a racist manner, though, as their team is the
    only major football club in the world named after a race of people, the
    Celts. Indeed the club were formed in 1888 specifically to further the
    cause of Irish Catholics in Glasgow, playing football being a secondary
    consideration. It could therefore be argued that Celtic FC are the most
    racist club in world football, and the actions and attitudes of their
    supporters in Scotland certainly give credence to this view. So, why do
    UEFA, or FARE for that matter, never threaten to hold Celtic FC accountable
    for their supporters actions? Indeed, UEFA awarded the Celtic fans a Fair
    Play award after the 2003 UEFA Cup final, during which many of the
    sectarian chants mentioned were clearly audible on TV. If UEFA take action
    against Rangers FC for their supporters actions, while not taking any
    action against Celtic FC, this would be seen in Scotland as hypocritical.
    Do UEFA condone racism against Protestants in Scotland? The award of the
    2003 Fair Play prize, combined with any action against Rangers FC and their
    supporters, would suggest they do.

    Despite what I have written, the most offensive chanting I have ever heard
    from supporters visiting Ibrox Stadium was not from Celtic supporters, but
    from those of Aberdeen FC. Every time their supporters visit Rangers' Ibrox
    home, they taunt us with chants about the Ibrox Stadium disaster of 1971.
    "Who's that lying on the runway, who's that dying in the snow" they sing,
    in reference to the tragedy in which 66 Rangers supporters died. This
    sickening chant is heard at every Rangers-Aberdeen match. Thousands of the
    victims' relatives still attend Ibrox, as indeed do many survivors of the
    disaster who were at the tragic match against Celtic in January 1971,
    including my own father. These people pay money to attend a football match
    and have to suffer these taunts from the Aberdeen supporters. Now it cannot
    be claimed that this chant is racist or sectarian, as Aberdeen FC have no
    specific ethnic identity as a club. Do UEFA, or FARE, think that these
    chants are acceptable, or somehow less serious or offensive, because they
    are not racist? I would dearly like clarification of your views on this.

    On a similar note, I would like to cite the example of FC.Barcelona and
    their supporters. At the recent match against Chelsea, on the same night as
    the Rangers-Villareal match in Spain, hundreds of their supporters seemed
    more concerned with waving political banners, about Catalunya not being
    part of Spain, than they were about the football being played. More serious
    were the actions of their supporters at the UEFA Cup tie against Celtic in
    Glasgow in 2004. This was the most sickening thing I have ever heard at a
    football match that I didn't attend, watching it on TV. On the same day as
    the Madrid bombings, which killed hundreds of Spanish citizens that very
    morning, the supporters of FC.Barcelona booed and jeered during a minute's
    silence mourning the victims of the terrorist attack. So much so that the
    referee had to cut short the mark of respect. No action was taken against
    FC.Barcelona and their supporters by UEFA. And yet UEFA are all too quick
    to react to punish Rangers FC, and clubs like Sparta Prague and Steaua
    Bucharest for alleged racist behaviour by a minority of their supporters.
    How can UEFA, or FARE possibly justify these double standards? Could it be
    that they only punish clubs who are seen as having right-wing followings,
    such as Rangers and Chelsea, while turning a blind eye to the antics of
    supposedly left-wing clubs, such as Celtic and Barcelona, who's supporters
    political views more closely mirror those of the decision makers at UEFA
    and FARE? Political bias would seem to be the only reason for this
    hypocrisy.

    It could be argued that international football is by definition racist, as
    a player cannot choose which country he represents, or move from one
    country to another, whereas in sports such as tennis and athletics this is
    possible. However clearly FIFA are trying to stamp out racism in the
    stands. And yet they and UEFA consistently award Fair Play prizes to the
    followers of the Scotland national team, the so-called Tartan Army. Do they
    not realise that the vast majority of Scotland's supporters chants are
    anti-English racism? "Stand up if you hate England," they sing, and almost
    all of them stand up. "If you hate the English clap your hands," and almost
    all applaud. "We hate Jimmy Hill - he's a Shirt Lifter." Jimmy Hill is an English
    TV commentator. This chant manages to be both racist and homophobic at
    once! Even the words of the national anthem 'Flower of Scotland' are
    racist, referring to ancient battles against the English. "You fought and
    died for your wee bit hill and glen, and sent them homewards to think
    again," Also "we can still rise now" suggests these battles are not yet
    over. Indeed, most countries national anthems refer to bloody battles of
    the past. Are UEFA, or FARE saying that racist anthems are unacceptable at
    club matches, yet perfectly acceptable at international matches? Or is it
    simply that you think it is OK to be racist against some groups, like the
    English, but not against other groups, such as the Irish? This attitude is
    in fact racist in itself! I have attended many Scotland matches and find
    that hatred against the English is the main motivation for most of their
    supporters being there. Will UEFA or FARE be monitoring Scotland matches in
    the future, and do you have any opinions on the Scottish Government's
    complete lack of action to tackle this particular brand of racism?

    In 1989 Rangers FC signed their first ever Catholic player, Maurice
    Johnston. They had an unwritten anti-Catholic signing policy for over 100
    years, but former manager Graeme Souness, and David Murray, still the club
    chairman, decided a racist employment policy could not be justified in the
    late 20th century. Thousands of Rangers supporters never returned to Ibrox.
    The player himself was subjected to hundreds of death threats, mostly from
    Celtic supporters who saw him as a traitor against his religion. As a
    result he has since had to emigrate to the USA. However, at least he played
    a part in ending the last racist signing policy by a major football club in
    Europe. Or was it? No, because even today, 17 years later, Athletic Bilbao
    still operate a racist signing policy in the Spanish league, refusing to
    field players who were not born and bred in the Basque region. This is in
    fact their supporters proudest boast, the fact that they have never been
    relegated from the Spanish Primera Liga while maintaining this racist
    employment policy. However, UEFA condone this policy by allowing the club
    to participate in European club competitions, and indeed UEFA have never
    comdemned Bilbao for this. While UEFA allow this, and FARE do not speak out
    against it, their anti-racism drives against other clubs are shown up to be
    a mockery! Once again one can only come to the conclusion that UEFA and
    FARE are not genuinely fighting racism, as they ignore racist behaviour by
    those clubs who are perceived to be left-wing and their supporters. Another
    example of this would be the way the Turkish FA were more severly punished
    by UEFA than the Swiss FA were, after the shameful scenes following
    Switzerland's World Cup play-off win over Turkey last November. This
    despite TV evidence clearly showing a gloating Swiss player had instigated
    the violence by assaulting a Turkish assistant on the pitch after the final
    whistle! I would therefore suggest that FARE are nothing more than a
    left-wing pressure group, and are more interested in using allegations of
    racism to shame clubs whos supporters political views they do not agree
    with. They are more interested in pointing the finger rather that actually
    fighting racism itself!

    In summary, these are the five main questions I would like to ask of UEFA
    and FARE.
    1. Why are Celtic FC and their supporters given Fair Play awards despite
    constant racist and sectarian behaviour against Protestant Rangers
    supporters?
    2. Do UEFA and FARE regard offensive behaviour which is not racist such as
    that of Aberdeen FC and their supporters to be less serious?
    3. Why are FC.Barcelona never punished for the racist, nationalistic, and
    political behaviour of their supporters?
    4. Why are the SFA, Scotland team and their supporters given Fair Play
    awards despite constant racist behaviour against the English?
    5. How can UEFA claim to be fighting racism when clubs like Athletic Bilbao
    are allowed to continue to operate a racist employment policy?

    These are changing times in Scotland. Protestant Rangers supporters feel
    increasingly persecuted and demonised by the new devolved Scottish
    Parliament and mainly Catholic-drsupporters are being
    accused of, and the racist behaviour such as monkey chanting iven media. Any action against the club by
    UEFA will merely increse this sense of injustice felt by many Protestants,
    given that no action is being taken against Celtic or the SFA. In effect
    UEFA would be seen to be taking sides in an ethnic dispute. This could even
    be counter-productive. I urge you to bear in mind that there is a major
    difference between the sectarian behaviour Rangers currently so
    prevalent in Italy and Spain. The difference is that Rangers FC and their
    supporters are as much the victims of sectarianism as they are the
    perpetrators in Scotland. I hope that UEFA take all of this into account
    when dealing with the allegations raised following the Villareal matches. I
    also hope that UEFA and FARE will take the time to respond to the points I
    have raised in this letter. I intend to share the contents of your response
    with other Rangers supporters on Internet message boards which are read by
    thousands, so this is a great opportunity for you to clarify behaviour
    which is and is not acceptable at UEFA Champions League matches. Any lack
    of response will also be well publicised.
    Yours sincerely,


    Long but interesting read that.

    Fabio
    "Cuore, Testa, Muscoli.. Da anni sognavamo un Gruppo cosi!!!
    Forza Ragazzi
    Nessuno escluso"

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    Hmm, interesting read indeed.

    I am new to this Rangers-Celtic stuff and the first time I heared how bad it is was when those two gentlemen argued about it on the boards.

    If the points are true, then the fan has a point. Chants against Protestants and making discriminant/racial chants against them is a no-no and I am surprised these things aren't on the open. I knew about the passionate rivaliry between Rangers-Celtics but had no idea about the sectarian stuff.

    Anyway, that is why I believe these things don't belong in soccer. You can chant for your team all you want, and you can call the other team anything you want (Losers, chockers etc.)

    But if you are to make fun of the other team's religion/colour, then keep your banners at home and save us the chants!

    On a final note, I don't think I'd consider what Bilbao does as racist. Although I don't agree with it and think that soccer should bring and not divide people, they can have that policy if they want. Some teams in the world don't allow foreigners (in other parts of the world.)

    Also, I think the Basques do it to distinguish themselves and preserve their culture. Maybe they feel that Spain wants to change their identity or whatever.

  18. #18
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    Nice post Hamed, lots of good points but I must say I disagree about Bilbao - it is wrong but nobody will change that, I mean - who would want to be the first non basque player to play for them!

    Fabio
    "Cuore, Testa, Muscoli.. Da anni sognavamo un Gruppo cosi!!!
    Forza Ragazzi
    Nessuno escluso"

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    Yeah Fabio, I said I understand it and it's not racist.

    But I guess I am not Basque or I am not that pateriotic to care alot about national stuff while many do. Like I said, maybe it's their way to tell their kids and the world that they are unique.

    BTW, I don't know if anybody would know that, but why don't they tell UEFA they want to make a Basque NT? I think that will be a stronger signal from them.

  20. #20
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    Yeah, basically Bilbao is like the Basque NT - if they feel so strong about it they should request to UEFA.

    About the Celtic - Rangers rivalry, I didn't know much about it but I have seen just how significant it is in Glasgow.

    Fabio
    "Cuore, Testa, Muscoli.. Da anni sognavamo un Gruppo cosi!!!
    Forza Ragazzi
    Nessuno escluso"

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