Quarter Final: Brazil - Belgium

[firmino]

I guess less talented teams have figured out how to limit a better opponent. In terms of skills and technique, Brazil is by far still the best team. The real, atrocious mistake they made was let Diego Costa slip away. That was unforgivable. He felt not considered and switched to Spain

 

[ADRossi]

Lukaku's first touch, and touch in general, is notoriously terrible. Not surprising.

 

[Palacio]

Lukaku's first touch, and touch in general, is notoriously terrible. Not surprising.

He is used as a distraction by Belgium.

 

[Wobblz]

Where did I say there's a conspiracy involved? I said money is involved. Brazil is trying to copy Europe. Europe as a whole has stopped breeding great talents in 15-20 years. The most talented kids usually give up the game because they're not physically strong enough. You want to call this "progress" or "the game has changed" all you want. There's no conspiracy, where do you come up with this shit..? Name me the most talented European players that came out in the last 10 years please. Don't talk to me about career success, or what their teams won, or whatever. Individual talent. It's not that hard. I said Mbappe is much more talented than Henry and people were like "Henry won everything". Who the fuck compared trophy cabinets? Sorry for the rant, but I'm just preparing you to give an answer to what is asked instead of what you'd like to be asked. So I repeat, a list of the MOST TALENTED players from Europe in the last 10 years. And I don't want to see names like Robben here, I want players that graduated from academies in the last decade.

It's not "better academies". It's academies full stop. The best talents in Europe still come from places like Croatia or the Balkans in general. They don't learn how to play in football academies, they watch great players and emulate them on the streets. The new generation learns "proper" football at academies so they are indeed generic. Everyone wants to follow the Spanish or Dutch model. So the rich Spanish teams get to produce technically precise players whilst Germans, who copied the Dutch model and have more money to polish it, have created their own generation.

All these players are fairly the same though. They're not carbon copies, but they're the best next thing. You rarely see individual brilliance any more. That's what Brazil was good at. And the "favela kid" statement was not an insult of any sort, it's just how things are. Poor neighbourhoods usually breed most of the best sports people. Football academies are a good thing for a society, but not really that great for the sporting spectacle.

People go 'wow' over a trivela or a 360 roulette ffs that occurs once every 15 games. We used to see amazing things multiple times in almost every game. That's why teams like Brazil need to go back to their own identity. The 'joga bonito' mentality.

Also, I didn't list 5 "super talented attackers". I listed their fucking downfall. If Coutinho, Willian and Douglas Costa are amongst the most talented players in the generation, you're screwed. Also, Brazil always played with 2 strikers up front. Now there's really no one to pick from.

I won't list any players man. Europe has stopped breeding talents in the last 20 years?! What's your point here? There are no amazing footballers anymore? Or that the truly great ones all "played on the street"?

I live in the fucking Balkans, you think there are no academies here? It's not like we're living in Sub-Saharan Africa, hell, those guys have academies as well I'm sure.

You're a romantic I get that, please just don't lose connection with reality.

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Roulettes and fancy dribbling are party tricks in football. If you do that shit in a professional match and fail a couple of times in a row you'll eat bench, It's a competitive sport for fucks sake. That was the case with many youngsters that tried to impress here at Inter of all places.

If you're into joga bonito so much go watch futsal. Trivela, there's plenty of players that can do it, Nainggolan is one. It's not some "lost knowledge" that died out with the ancient greats.

But yeah, just look a Quaresma, all the trivela shots and roulettes you'll ever need - still a mediocre player for a competitive side. He can get away with that shit in Turkey or Dubai, even Portugal all he wants, but not on top level.

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If you think Coutinho, Willian or Douglas Costa aren't talented enough then that's your problem. And their talents have nothing to do with the fact that the team as a whole isn't good enough a unit.

 

[brehme1989]

I didn't say there aren't any academies in the Balkans. Fuck, I'm a Balkanite too

I said that it's the one place that still produces players outside of academies. Sure, they have to get into a team at some point, but if you've lived elsewhere you'd see that football is relatively dead outside of football academies. People 'live' football through playing in a set, club-run environment, through video games, through the internet (social media etc) and by watching some popular leagues or teams. That's about it.

You go to these countries and you see kids playing in the streets still. That's where you're going to learn how to be different. And that's why Croatia is the best talent pool in Europe, albeit a very small one.

As for those players, they aren't talented enough to be the top talents of Brazil. That's a historic fact.

[I cannot believe this is a discussion I'm having with someone's whose listed favorite player is Roberto Baggio]

 

[Wobblz]

I'm not arguing with what you say. I'm arguing that things have changed. Yeah, football is much more robotic nowadays, fantasista type of players are literally dying out, etc. but this is how it is.

From what you said I gathered that you want the old days to come back somehow, but we are well beyond the point of no return.

 

[brehme1989]

I'm not arguing with what you say. I'm arguing that things have changed. Yeah, football is much more robotic nowadays, fantasista type of players are literally dying out, etc. but this is how it is.

Exactly. And I'm saying I'm not fine with it and it's dreadful to watch

 

[Wobblz]

Exactly. And I'm saying I'm not fine with it and it's dreadful to watch

I know that feel bro.

Okay, I'm curious, who's your favourite modern-day player?

 

[brehme1989]

I know that feel bro.

Okay, I'm curious, who's your favourite modern-day player?

There isn't one that I'd say is my favorite. Outside Inter players and using mostly forwards (I like guys like Godin and Casemiro but yeah), I can say that I like watching guys like Cavani, Hazard, Mbappe, Insigne, Sane, Milinkovic-Savic, Neymar, Luis Suarez, Messi and de Bruyne. A few more for sure but can't recall now. Can't say I have a favorite. Can't really say that about an Inter player, but then again, Skriniar came to our lives

 

[Zoro]

Anyone else noticed how atrocious the touches Lukaku made in that second goal? He literally lost the ball three times and had to change his direction to keep up with it but no one was around to stop him so it led to an easy counter. He saved his only good touch for last, just before the crucial tackle. Good play by Lukaku of course, but he was lucky no one was around when the situation began. Also atrocious was the defending by Brazil in the midfield in that play.

Here's a good view of it. First touch, way off. Second touch, also off. Fourth touch, also off and felt accidental. If there was someone there, it'd stop the counter. Lukaku reacted very well after that, but it was terrible team defending in the middle by Brazil once again.

Completely agree with this part. I have a lot of Belgian friends in a group chat and I'm obviously supporting them, but his touches were shit. They said that they didn't care cause goal happened and I was the only one that mentioned the shit touches. But I say a better team defensively and that wasn't a goal. Still happy with the result though

 

[J..]

Coaches are better equipped - they have superior data gathering tools (like the bras players wear), superior video capture, archiving and analysis; superior statistical analysis; superior fitness and coaching staff, superior training grounds etc. Kids from favelas will do shit when they measure up against a well-prepared academy product, yeah they might have some outrageous innate talent, but only that leads you nowhere in today's game.

Great post. The reason to why Germany came back strongly after their huge disappointment back in 2002 was due to the massively investment from the German FA in nationwide training facilities. An overall philosophy in which you developed the players to be effective in the exact same system has benefitted them a lot.

The same goes for Belgium. Their golden generation is not due to luck but because of a well organized system. This Guardian article sums it up briefly. https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...print-gave-birth-golden-generation-world-cup-

Talking about video capturing. I saw this article recently about the video wall Hoffenheims coach Nagelsmann has got constructed for training sessions. Even the drills in the training schedules are recorded and briefed now. https://www.bundesliga.com/en/news/...ideowall-to-revolutionise-training-454562.jsp

Great teams depended on talent back in the days but now it is more due to effective youth development. Talent isn't that important today as before which means great individual performances do not happen as often.

 

[wera]

Luckily I found a gif of this

 

[Pajo]

Hazard is very intelligent player. VERY. One of the smartest and most creative player on earth. That move was simply spectacular.

 

[Native]

I've found Hazard pretty underwhelming all tournament. The Belgian player that surprised / impressed me the most is Meunier.

 

[Dylan]

I don't watch Man City very often, what is it that Fernandinho does?

 

[wicked wizard]

Luckily I found a gif of this

Decent bit of play what's the big deal?. Hazard has got to be the most overrated player on earth

 

[Dylan]

Name 3 wingers better than him that aren't Neymar or Messi playing on the wing.

If he gets the big money move to Madrid then I think he can explode to the top tier of players. Chelsea isn't the place for him. He's a great dribbler and I think he has the talent to become world class, he's not a brainless head down - dribble hard type of winger.

 

[Candreva Crosses]

Decent bit of play what's the big deal?. Hazard has got to be the most overrated player on earth

He makes some nice dribbles and all of the sudden he is the new Ronaldo.

 

[Dylan]

He makes some nice dribbles and all of the sudden he is the new Ronaldo.

What? Hazard was the "flash in the pan dribbler talent" maybe 3 years ago, he's consistently one of the top attackers in football today.

 

[monster09]

I don't watch Man City very often, what is it that Fernandinho does?

He is very good for them, they usually play 4-1-4-1 formation with Fernandinho as DM, KdB and Silva as AMs. Fernandinho is good defensively and moves the ball quicker, he covers lot of ground too. Pep system also helps him.

Before Pep, when he joined City he used to play as box to box, but now he plays deeper. He isn't all that great, he is for sure looks good because of Pep's system.