Mauro Icardi

[magnesium]

Roma's midfield had Nainggolan, De Rossi, Strootman and Paredes and their flanks consisted of Salah, El Sharaawy and Perotti with Dzeko up front and the luxury of bringing Totti in. Our midfield cannot pass the ball to each other, let alone score.

I am not agree with you, Our midfield joyful to watch.
Combination Brozovic, Gagliardini, and Rafinha are very very good.

 

[Dylan]

I am not agree with you, Our midfield joyful to watch.
Combination Brozovic, Gagliardini, and Rafinha are very very good.

They could be, I would be happy with a 433 with those starting if we seriously upgraded our RW to a goalscoring threat.

 

[brehme1989]

I am not agree with you, Our midfield joyful to watch.
Combination Brozovic, Gagliardini, and Rafinha are very very good.

Sure, they managed to play better than usual with the ball on the ground, but did they move forward? Did they score? Did they shoot? Did they open up the play? We only had one good game against Sampdoria and that was mostly Icardi killing them early on with Perisic finally remembering that he's a professional football player and the rest of the team simply picked up.

From that Roma roster, I cannot name a player who cannot get on the score sheet. From our team, I'd even put Candreva's name there at the beginning of the season but other than Perisic and Brozovic, none of the others score. Vecino could get a couple a season but that doesn't count, even D'Ambrosio can do that. I mean game in, game out. We have no scorers. And it's not becasue we depend on Icardi. We depend on him because no one else can do this shit.

 

[Shaun]

Roma's midfield had Nainggolan, De Rossi, Strootman and Paredes and their flanks consisted of Salah, El Sharaawy and Perotti with Dzeko up front and the luxury of bringing Totti in. Our midfield cannot pass the ball to each other, let alone score.

Nainggolan before last season was never seen as a player with much attacking chops. Perotti was bought by Roma for half of what Perisic and Candreva were for us, and El Sharaaway was called a one season wonder before he joined Roma. Furthermore Dzeko looked like he couldn't hit the back of a brick wall before Spalletti arrived.

Plus you make it sound like our players don't have attacking credentials. Candreva has over 50 goals in Serie A and often was in double digits in his last seasons at Lazio. Perisic is viewed as one of the best wingers in the league. Valero and Vecino were a part of a Fiorentina side that played good attacking football, and Cancelo is one of the most attacking fullbacks in the league. Not to mention that Serie A isn't what it used to be defensively. More goals are being scored in Italy these days, but we're struggling

 

[brehme1989]

Nainggolan before last season was never seen as a player with much attacking chops. Perotti was bought by Roma for half of what Perisic and Candreva were for us, and El Sharaaway was called a one season wonder before he joined Roma. Furthermore Dzeko looked like he couldn't hit the back of a brick wall before Spalletti arrived.

Plus you make it sound like our players don't have attacking credentials. Candreva has over 50 goals in Serie A and often was close to double digits in his last seasons at Lazio. Perisic is viewed as one of the best wingers in the league. Valero and Vecino were a part of a Fiorentina side that played good attacking football, and Cancelo is one of the most attacking fullbacks in the league. Not to mention that Serie A isn't what it used to be defensively. More goals are being scored in Italy these days, but we're struggling

Nainggolan scored 5-10 goals a season for Roma. He scored 15 last season, yeah, we called it the Spalletti factor. But it's not like he created a scoring midfielder out of thin air.

Fiorentina did not play good attacking football. Fiorentina played POSSESSION football. At least under Paulo Sousa. It wasn't really good, it wasn't really 'attacking' unless we completely forgotten what attack means. Passing the ball around is as defensive as it is attacking. If you thought Valero and Vecino could score 5 a piece, well, sorry.

 

[ADRossi]

I'm tired of Icardi. I'm tired of him disappearing for minutes on end. I'm tired of him standing around and complaining that his teammates aren't spoon feeding him good enough chances. I'm tired of him not being able to beat any competent defenders off the dribble. I'm tired of him getting out-run by 31 year old CBs. We've been watching this for 3 years, and absolutely nothing has changed or gotten better.

Say what you want about his teammates, but his general lack of dribbling and pace will always be a story. He's a good player, but I have a hard time believing we will ever win anything worth a damn with him leading the charge. If someone wants to offer us 110 million Euros for him, then they can have him.

 

[Shaun]

Nainggolan scored 5-10 goals a season for Roma. He scored 15 last season, yeah, we called it the Spalletti factor. But it's not like he created a scoring midfielder out of thin air.

Fiorentina did not play good attacking football. Fiorentina played POSSESSION football. At least under Paulo Sousa. It wasn't really good, it wasn't really 'attacking' unless we completely forgotten what attack means. Passing the ball around is as defensive as it is attacking. If you thought Valero and Vecino could score 5 a piece, well, sorry.

Okay, I'll concede about Fiorentina only playing possession football, but we have better attackers than they did. Icardi is twice the player Kalinic is surely? Tello, Bobacar, a 18 year old Chiesa. Outside of Bernadeschi their attackers were not up to much, but yet we're struggling to score less than they did. And we're doing so without Europe, and with basically no serious injuries

Plus, we have a 100m+ CF in our team.

 

[magnesium]

I'm tired of Icardi. I'm tired of him disappearing for minutes on end. I'm tired of him standing around and complaining that his teammates aren't spoon feeding him good enough chances. I'm tired of him not being able to beat any competent defenders off the dribble. I'm tired of him getting out-run by 31 year old CBs. We've been watching this for 3 years, and absolutely nothing has changed or gotten better.

Say what you want about his teammates, but his general lack of dribbling and pace will always be a story. He's a good player, but I have a hard time believing we will every win anything worth a damn with him leading the charge. If someone wants to offer us 110 million Euros for him, then they can have him.

I feel Icardi playing style is outdated, we need change his playing style at least like Eto'o, Falcao, or Milito.

If he can't do that, lets sell him and buy someone like Salah or Griezmann, and replace Icardi with Lautaro Martinez, who had similar playing style like Aguero.

 

[brehme1989]

Okay, I'll concede about Fiorentina only playing possession football, but we have better attackers than they did. Icardi is twice the player Kalinic is surely? Tello, Bobacar, a 18 year old Chiesa. Outside of Bernadeschi their attackers were not up to much, but yet we're struggling to score less than they did. And we're doing so without Europe, and with basically no serious injuries

Plus, we have a 100m+ CF in our team.

But neither Valero nor Vecino created that many goals for Fiorentina. Valero sort of carried the ball around the most and was more direct than what we've seen, but due to their style, he had the luxury of playing as a playmaking attacking midfielder, so you may see some inflated assist numbers but they got their goals from Kalinic, Babacar, Bernardeschi and they also had contributions from Chiesa and Ilicic. All of them are scoring players, at least you could argue that they're more likely to end up in the scoresheet more often than Valero or Vecino.


Also, people who are asking for Icardi to be sold and ask for some established star in return have no clue of what they're saying. Who will come if Inter sell their best asset and captain? What does it say about this club? It shows that we've given up. No one will come. You can only spend it on 3-4 players and at least 2 of them will not be worth it.

 

[ADRossi]

Didn't Valero have 10 assists at Fiorentina last year?

 

[Shaun]

I feel Icardi playing style is outdated, we need change his playing style at least like Eto'o, Falcao, or Milito.

If he can't do that, lets sell him and buy someone like Salah or Griezmann, and replace Icardi with Lautaro Martinez, who had similar playing style like Aguero.

I would like Salah or Griezmann as much as the next person, but if we sell Icardi we would not be getting a player like them. Nor can you rely on some Argentine kid who has never left his home town to replace Icardi.

Also, I still think if we qualify for the CL than Icardi has to stay. His attributes both from both a positive and negative standpoint are largely responsible for the way we play. If we qualify for the CL he would be the one most responsible for accomplishing that and therefore deserves the right to lead us in that competition. However if we don't qualify I feel we should definitely look for a different avenue up front.

 

[brehme1989]

Didn't Valero have 10 assists at Fiorentina last year?

9 Serie A assists.
4 of them were lay offs to a player that scored, not really the creative kind of pass, just the last player to hold the ball before the scorer shot it. The last one iirc was a pass to Vecino who was at the middle of the pitch, run around 10 meters and then unleashed a beautiful shot. I mean, he just made the right pass and in half those chances it wasn't a goal scoring opportunity.
2 of them from corners he took. He took them frequently but he wasn't the only set piece taker.
1 of them was a great lob that penetrated the defence.
1 of them was a cross from deep.
Also another one was against us, he found Ilicic from deep, he run at least 10 meters until he unleashed a shot that went it. They count it as an assist but it's a stretch. It was a good ball but without that run from Ilicic it wasn't really a scoring chance.

We're talking creativity here and Valero does not have it. He never did. He's just a very good technical player that can carry the ball around the midfield.

 

[Shaun]

Also, people who are asking for Icardi to be sold and ask for some established star in return have no clue of what they're saying. Who will come if Inter sell their best asset and captain? What does it say about this club? It shows that we've given up. No one will come. You can only spend it on 3-4 players and at least 2 of them will not be worth it.

Well you could have said that (and many did) when we sold Zlatan and look how that turned out? We cannot simply do the same thing every season if it's not working. Up until now our attack with Icardi as our striker hasn't worked. So I would want to see something different if we do not qualify for the CL

 

[brehme1989]

Well you could have (and many did) said that when we sold Zlatan and look how that turned out? We cannot simply do the same thing every season if it's not working. Up until now our attack with Icardi as our striker hasn't worked. So I would want to see something different if we do not qualify for the CL

Nope. That's the worst possible example. We're 7th placed team now.
We had won so many on the trot and were making the quarters of CL every year.
We had Maicon, Zanetti, Cambiasso, Samuel, Stankovic and so many other great players. And we didn't really just sell Zlatan, the offer was $$$ + Eto'o. Other circumstances and Zlatan was sold to eg Real Madrid or Man Utd at the time, Eto'o wouldn't have been part of the deal, nor would he be available. So we'd be stuck with Milito, Balotelli and Pandev and try desperately to sign a striker and Aguero was not on the market that season. We could have gone for Drogba who's had one of this best years ever at Chelsea but I doubt they'd sell him. Ironically enough, I think we could have gone for Dzeko.

 

[JJM]

I love Icardi but I agree with Shaun...if we fail to get CL...we might as well try something different...however Icardi has to play with CANDREVA WHO SEEMS DONE as a prof player tbh and a hot n cold...mostly cold Perisic...

but then play what?!

Lautaro won't be enough with...

I'd go for Timo Werner...dude is nothing like Icardi...he is mobile af...can do shit on his own...can score his own goals...but...him wanting to come to Italy from Germany?!

If we sell Icardi we can do this...

Werner-Martinez
Rafinha
Perisic-Brozo/Barella-Torreira/Gags-Cancelo
Miranda-Skriniar-DeVrij
Handa


get Torreira and Barella...to strengthen the mf...Valero is pretty much done next season,Gags and Vecino erm I dunno...Brozo's future is still unsure...


OTHER NAMES: Chiesa,Verdi

I'd look in to Lozano and Thauvin as well...also Santi Mina from Valencia(we love business with them)

 

[Shaun]

Nope. That's the worst possible example. We're 7th placed team now.
We had won so many on the trot and were making the quarters of CL every year.
We had Maicon, Zanetti, Cambiasso, Samuel, Stankovic and so many other great players. And we didn't really just sell Zlatan, the offer was $$$ + Eto'o. Other circumstances and Zlatan was sold to eg Real Madrid or Man Utd at the time, Eto'o wouldn't have been part of the deal, nor would he be available. So we'd be stuck with Milito, Balotelli and Pandev and try desperately to sign a striker and Aguero was not on the market that season. We could have gone for Drogba who's had one of this best years ever at Chelsea but I doubt they'd sell him. Ironically enough, I think we could have gone for Dzeko.

We're not that bad...yet anyway.

I get it. You think Icardi is in no way the problem for our side. I simply disagree. And we will never know for sure until he leaves because we have no even remotely decent replacements here. I would point to our brief periods with other quality strikers leading our line (Jovetic and Osvaldo) in the Icardi era which showed that him not playing that not much changed from a goal-scoring perspective, but people would argue that the sample size wasn't big enough and I would certainly not argue that.

I don't think we'll magically play great attacking football if we replace Icardi, but I do feel his game limits the team as a whole and I think if we do not get a CL spot it's not stupid to try something new, nor do I feel it would be a sign that we're giving in to mediocrity or something as you're implying. With or without Icardi if we're still not a CL team than big players will not arrive, so I would personally like to have funds to change the squad rather than try the same thing that has failed in consecutive seasons.

 

[brehme1989]

Well, we finished 7th last season, didn't we? And three seasons ago? 8th was it?

I understand that kind of thought, but it'd make sense if we were talking about Paloschi or Caracciolo. We're talking about a world class striker here and teams would kill to have him. We prefer to kill ourselves by gifting him elsewhere instead of playing to his strengths.

Had we kept Banega this season, Icardi would have had better moments. Had Candreva managed to be a threat this season, Icardi would have had better moments. Had Vecino, Gagliardini and Brozovic be able to score more, Icardi would have had better moments. Did he miss anything that he should have buried? Probably more than 5 crucial chances, including two vs Milan recently. Does anyone else have such moments? Well, Dzeko, Immobile, Higuain certainly do. If you want to compare with non-Serie A strikers... Kane has many more and in bigger games (remember his Juventus and Real Madrid open goal sitters in the CL?), Morata has, Benzema has, Lukaku certainly has, Suarez has, even Messi has. Name any high profile striker and they all have their share of bad moments, moments of "disappearing" etc.

Napoli sold Higuain reluctantly and have found their goals through Mertens unexpectedly. Their 35m signing in Milik failed to not only replicate that, but even reach 10 goals. I'm not even saying it's in two seasons because it's unfair to him and his injuries, but he sat on the bench a lot. Napoli replaced Higuain through sheer midfield fire power and made the position redundant. They already had scoring threats there, they simply managed to highlight them. We cannot because we don't have scoring threats. Unless you think we can make Perisic a striker.

I cannot think of a team that sold a world class striker and became better. Even with Inter, when we sold Crespo (would say Ronaldo but we had Crespo lined up already who was also world class), we replaced him with a solid Serie A striker in Julio Cruz but he wasn't anywhere near world class and Vieri was still recovering from injuries and mental issues. It took us until Adriano came a few months later to sort of recover from that but we were shit in Europe during that season despite making CL semis the previous year.

Look at Milan after selling Zlatan. Their first proper striker after him came 3 seasons later when they signed Carlos Bacca.
What about Lazio when they sold Crespo to us?
What about Chelsea when they let Drogba go after that (lucky) CL? Fernando Torres, Demba Ba, an old Eto'o until they signed Diego Costa 2 seasons later and won the league.
Arsenal after Henry? They tried to replace him with players like Eduardo, they even lost van Persie in the process, Giroud and they didn't really get a major striker until Lacazzette joined in the summer (and wasn't really good) and finally they got a star striker in Aubameyang more than 10 years after letting Henry leave. And they've always been in the CL before this season, so it wasn't even an excuse.

World class strikers are not easily replaceable. And you rarely seem teams benefiting from selling them. On paper it sounds like you can build a whole new team, but in practice where is it? Not many are crazy enough to give you a world class striker in the deal for yours like the Zlatan-Eto'o deal.

We have Icardi, he's happy here, he's the captain like it or not and we must build a team that's good enough to highlight his abilities. And that's how we establish the team as a perennial CL participant and eventually contender.
Unless you really feel that we have more than 6 players from the current team that you'd like to see in the next 5 years sticking around excluding Icardi.

 

[Wallace]

The problem is we have several limitations within the squad, not one problem.

Our problem isn't something that one Banega can resolve or one Rafinha can resolve. It's a general lack of technical quality and lack of variance in ability that results in us being at times predictable against a well coordinated defense.

The only way we can feasibly resolve our issue is bring in multiple personnel, and the only way we can generate the sum that allows us to purchase quality in quantity is through the sale of Icardi.

But I am against this sale because Icardi is simply too important.

I think we are stuck tbh.

 

[brehme1989]

We spend roughly 70m a season on transfers in the last 3 seasons and we're definitely going for a 4th with Gagliardini's transfer being completed, Cancelo probably redeemed, Rafinha's 38m clause is also considered, there's Martinez with his 15-20m, there's a Vecino instalment of 8m and more. If we are more sensible about that and follow a different strategy, we'll improve everything over two seasons to the highest level.

Arguably we have the money but we're wasting it. Which is why I want to be extremely careful on splashing 38m on Cancelo and 38m on Rafinha (35-38 is their reported clauses, I think the best sources suggest it's 38 for both with Valencia is using a Kondogbia + Murillio formula).

There's no team on a limited* budget that spends 35m on a couple of players and succeeds. Look at Milan wasting 40m on Andre Silva + Bonucci and 20-25m on Conti, Biglia, Rodriguez, Hakan, Musacchio. All other teams that spend so much on transfers have more than 150m to spend and a relatively complete roster around the new guys. Milan went all in and they fucked it up. I made a list of two years ago and the only teams that don't really have the money but have made a couple of these transfers are Atletico, Dortmund and a one-off by Bilbao who are simply replacing Laporte (with a probably better player and 2/3 of the price). Bilbao is unique, but the other two are established in Europe in the last few years and have been replacing their players with money they had received. We don't have that luxury.

 

[varmin]

I'm still wondering will be better to sell Icardi and his companions in attack - Perisic, Candreva and Eder. Add the sales of Kondogbia and Mario and we can get 200+ mln for total overhauling of our attack and midifield.