The Suning Commerce Group

[.h.]

yeah, but the Elliott ownership of Milan isnt a long term thing. They keep the club attractive to a new investor, and once that investor takes over the club, they can work out what to do.

They've got low wage, young players who (mostly?) have plusvalenza versus their book amount, so if you decide to spend a lot of money, you can get rid of them, make profit, and then invest in bigger name players. If you want to keep them, then you can increase their wages. It's quite clever all together, much more so than having old (30+) players on long term contracts like Inter do.


I agree with you that, if Elliott were to hold on to Milan for 5 more years, a lot of the kids will leave for better clubs because they wont get paid as well at Milan. But this is just about making Milan attractive to buyers. In terms of the immediate squad, the only key area of investment is a striker - the rest of the team is mostly OK for, probably, a top 6 guaranteed finish. With a new investor you could also push on sponsorship, then getting top 4 isnt unreasonable at all once Ibra leaves, and if they want to pump the club full of money they can, or if they dont want to, they can just leave it as it is.

This isnt that unusual for private equity - they've kind of got the foundations of many things there, but not overly committed in a way that someone with a new head/direction will find it a burden.

 

[bmotion]

yeah, but the Elliott ownership of Milan isnt a long term thing. They keep the club attractive to a new investor, and once that investor takes over the club, they can work out what to do.

They've got low wage, young players who (mostly?) have plusvalenza versus their book amount, so if you decide to spend a lot of money, you can get rid of them, make profit, and then invest in bigger name players. If you want to keep them, then you can increase their wages. It's quite clever all together, much more so than having old (30+) players on long term contracts like Inter do.

I honestly don’t agree with this. I only see Theo as a valuable player of theirs and his market is only PSG at the moment I don’t see any other top European club in need of a left back at that price at the moment. While we have Skrinar, Bastoni Barella, Lautaro. With much higher value and with much higher market . Right now our team has higher floor for success with potentially less money spent if a new owner comes.

 

[.h.]

Value against their book value. Probably every single one of their players could be sold for plusvalenza? Except Conti/Caldera. Whereas look at us, weve just finally got rid of nainggolan and JM. Vecino probanly won't fetch his book value, nor will Eriksen, nor will Dalbert or Lazaro.

Kessie is about to renew in his final year - his amortisation cost will be damn near 0. We are still carrying a heavy amortisation book (not sure the latest figures but probanly north of 90m a season by the time the mercato closes?)


Just to be clear, from this side we're kind of healthy. Our salary book is steadily increasing lately, but we do have a lot of plusvalenza in the team as well. That being said, the market for 60m+ players (e.g. Skriniar, Bastoni, Barella) is clearly smaller than the market for 20m+ players - so from some kind of ease of sale perspective, Milan is probably in a healthier position from that side. We obviously do have a number of players whose contract expire in the next 12 months, such as Handanovic, Kolarov, Ranocchia, DAmbro, Perisic, Vidal, Brozovic, Vecino, but we're still committed to some fairly expensive contracts on the book (Dzeko, Sanchez are just two obvious examples, and we're probably going to renew a number of people before the end of the season).

From the flexibility perspective, I think Milan provides more flexibility to an investor right now - they can take it in a number of directions. For Inter, you'd be really disrupting the club if you moved away from Bastoni/Barella/Skriniar/Lautaro IMHO, it'd take a lot of effort to sell those guys, and it'd take a lot more effort to replace them.



tl;dr I think what I'm trying to say is that Milan might be more appealing as a greenfield project - losses, albeit high, will be mitigated by season tickets + CL revenue. Inter is a more appealing brownfield project - e.g. you want to inherit a team with several key players, and just improve upon it. Milan is more of a blank slate.

 

[CafeCordoba]

But Milan's CL revenues are not guarantee. They are coming this season, but what about the next? The squad isn't something which you could say guarantees a top4 finish, nowhere near. I'd say only Juve and Inter (with proper) coaches should be top4 locks (roster-wise). The competition for top4 spots will be fierce also this season with Roman sides having experienced coaches there and Napoli also upgrading in coaching. Atalanta being Atalanta, not much has changed so expect them to be there right till the end as well.

That amortization thing is interesting. With Joao Mario, Nainggolan, Lukaku and Hakimi, we lost like well over 30m€ of annual amortization costs. (of course Nainggolan brings -10m€ capital loss with the contract termination). Amortizations will go down a bit with extensions of Barella and Bastoni. Lautaro and Brozovic extensions won't have much effect.

And then with Lukaku + Hakimi sales we have like close to 90m€ of plusvalenza. Amort

 

[bmotion]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1427240587967795202

so does this mean we gave up the Super League idea? So Sunning’s idea Inter worth more cuz its place in the Super League is now collapsing in my reading.

 

[CafeCordoba]

The rumor is indeed that Zhangs stopped the negotiations with BC Partners as they thought getting into Super league will get a higher value for the club.

Fucking idiots.

 

[bmotion]

Clearly failed on both plans now

 

[Zarok77]

imo Zangs are NOT coming back to Milan... unless project stadium gets approved within Christmas (doubt it)

 

[RickyMaravilla'sRightFoot]

Suning will reportedly accept the first 600-700million offer.

Would rather take an established network of ransomware criminals over the Zhangs at this point.

 

[.h.]

Suning will reportedly accept the first 600-700million offer.

Would rather take an established network of ransomware criminals over the Zhangs at this point.

"Sponsor Inter or we delete your data"

 

[Zarok77]

Oh, forgot to mention my accountant name is "Su Ning"

 

[pupivn]

Oh, forgot to mention my accountant name is "Su Ning"

Well their name is the combination of Jiangsu(su) and Nanjing(ning), where they're located. Ning also means peaceful or safe. At the moment, not so much ...

 

[Nyall]

yeah, but the Elliott ownership of Milan isnt a long term thing.

Yet here you are defending Suning as if whatever the fuck they're doing at Inter is a long term thing.

 

[.h.]

The actions that are needed at Inter are the same either way. Cut costs, get rid of unwanted players, and get healthy again. We lose 50mil a season even excluding Covid. Milan should be about cost neutral with CL.

 

[andrei]

The actions that are needed at Inter are the same either way. Cut costs, get rid of unwanted players, and get healthy again. We lose 50mil a season even excluding Covid. Milan should be about cost neutral with CL.

Yes, I will be curious how our balance sheet will look like next year! We reduced our squad cost with roughly 50m. If the stadium wil be at least 50% capacity for the full year, there are another 50m, we don't have Spallo and Conte (minus the goldshake), probably another 10m. I understand Socios pay us more then Pirelli.
I think we could be profitabe or at least neutral.
Next year Vidal, Vecino and Perisic are out. There is enough room to acomodate other players, without too much financial gimnastic. though I believe Lautaro will be gone next year.

 

[andrei]

Value against their book value. Probably every single one of their players could be sold for plusvalenza? Except Conti/Caldera. Whereas look at us, weve just finally got rid of nainggolan and JM. Vecino probanly won't fetch his book value, nor will Eriksen, nor will Dalbert or Lazaro.

Kessie is about to renew in his final year - his amortisation cost will be damn near 0. We are still carrying a heavy amortisation book (not sure the latest figures but probanly north of 90m a season by the time the mercato closes?)


Just to be clear, from this side we're kind of healthy. Our salary book is steadily increasing lately, but we do have a lot of plusvalenza in the team as well. That being said, the market for 60m+ players (e.g. Skriniar, Bastoni, Barella) is clearly smaller than the market for 20m+ players - so from some kind of ease of sale perspective, Milan is probably in a healthier position from that side. We obviously do have a number of players whose contract expire in the next 12 months, such as Handanovic, Kolarov, Ranocchia, DAmbro, Perisic, Vidal, Brozovic, Vecino, but we're still committed to some fairly expensive contracts on the book (Dzeko, Sanchez are just two obvious examples, and we're probably going to renew a number of people before the end of the season).

From the flexibility perspective, I think Milan provides more flexibility to an investor right now - they can take it in a number of directions. For Inter, you'd be really disrupting the club if you moved away from Bastoni/Barella/Skriniar/Lautaro IMHO, it'd take a lot of effort to sell those guys, and it'd take a lot more effort to replace them.



tl;dr I think what I'm trying to say is that Milan might be more appealing as a greenfield project - losses, albeit high, will be mitigated by season tickets + CL revenue. Inter is a more appealing brownfield project - e.g. you want to inherit a team with several key players, and just improve upon it. Milan is more of a blank slate.

What you say it's just a moment situation. Elliott will want those 700m plus a few hundred millions in plus. Zhang will want also a few hundred millions above our 600m+ debt. In 2 years all our bad contract will be gone. The actual bad contracts.
At the end of the day both clubs are pretty similar from this point of view. Don't have their own stadium. Roughly the same match revenues (our a little bit more). TV revenues more or less the same. Both big clubs with pedigree, who in the last years where in shadow (we stay better).
The difference will be made how the clubs will be manged. On the field (how many Joao Marios or Caldaras will be bought) and economically (sponsorship).

 

[Harpsabu]

What you say it's just a moment situation. Elliott will want those 700m plus a few hundred millions in plus. Zhang will want also a few hundred millions above our 600m+ debt. In 2 years all our bad contract will be gone. The actual bad contracts.
At the end of the day both clubs are pretty similar from this point of view. Don't have their own stadium. Roughly the same match revenues (our a little bit more). TV revenues more or less the same. Both big clubs with pedigree, who in the last years where in shadow (we stay better).
The difference will be made how the clubs will be manged. On the field (how many Joao Marios or Caldaras will be bought) and economically (sponsorship).

You're forgetting, we will replace those bad contracts with more bad contracts. Could be dzeko, could be dumfries, zapata etc. But we always have to account for having trash on the books

 

[andrei]

You're forgetting, we will replace those bad contracts with more bad contracts. Could be dzeko, could be dumfries, zapata etc. But we always have to account for having trash on the books

Every club have trash on the books. The problem is how much? We had actually pretty much. Vidal, Sanchez, Perisic were pretty expensive from what they brought on the field. Not to mention Nainggolan and Joao Mario.

 

[bmotion]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1428087276337303562

I’m not sure it will have an effect on Inter or not

 

[CafeCordoba]

Yes, I will be curious how our balance sheet will look like next year! We reduced our squad cost with roughly 50m. If the stadium wil be at least 50% capacity for the full year, there are another 50m, we don't have Spallo and Conte (minus the goldshake), probably another 10m. I understand Socios pay us more then Pirelli.
I think we could be profitabe or at least neutral.
Next year Vidal, Vecino and Perisic are out. There is enough room to acomodate other players, without too much financial gimnastic. though I believe Lautaro will be gone next year.

We don't have Spallo but we have Conte+Inzaghi which equals Conte's full salary.

Also while we removed quite some contracts, even big ones, we've added Dzeko and Dumfries and will add one striker. Then we are going to extend Barella, Brozovic, De Vrij and Lautaro which will be a big one. I'd say we ain't saving shit this season when it comes to player salaries.

Amortization costs are surely something we are saving as extensions will lower them (Barella extension will have the biggest effect as his fee was big). And of course Lukaku + Hakimi amortization costs are removed completely so that will have the biggest effect.